British Standards ? Set me straight please ?

[Leatherface]

Please can someone set me straight on this British Standards issue ?

Of all, of our members I imagine that only a small percentile are familiar with all of the British Standards pertaining to tiling ? Copies of which ( as far as I am aware ) are only available to purchase at an exorbitant cost, £160 per updated issue.
( see link )BS 5385 - BS 5385-4:2009

I do not profess to tile to British Standards, I tile to the best of my ability with the knowledge and advice I have available. As do I imagine most of us here ?

Q. Are these law ? Or obligatory ?
Q. Ignorance is no excuse in a court of law, but if you carry out a job that does not fully conform to BS5385-4:2009, does this make you either negligent or accountable ? Whether or not you advertise as carrying out your work to said Standard ?

Q. Why if this is so necessary do they charge so much for access to this information, should it not be freely available in the interests of people being able to adhere to the Standards ?

Advise please, confused ?

 

[Spud]

They are guidelines for best practice so they are not statutory, just guide lines ,if you do however get involved in a legal wrangle with a customer they will be the reference that a judge would make an informed decision on and what any lawyer would argue that a professional tiler should be working to ,if you have a library close to you you can have a look at them for free for an hour, you may take notes but you cant copy them if you wish to look at then for more than an hour the library will charge you, i agree that they cost too much and they should be subsidised if you are a british passport holder and work within the feild of reference you wish to acquire, if they were £50 per part then they would sell like hotcakes, i just dont understand the bsi, in the usa they produce the hand book for ceramic tile installation every year ,this gives guide lines and specifcations for the american standards it costs around $12, why we dont have that here is beyond me, hope this helps
gary

 

[Leatherface]

They are guidelines for best practice so they are not statutory, just guide lines ,if you do however get involved in a legal wrangle with a customer they will be the reference that a judge would make an informed decision on and what any lawyer would argue that a professional tiler should be working to ,if you have a library close to you you can have a look at them for free for an hour, you may take notes but you cant copy them if you wish to look at then for more than an hour the library will charge you, i agree that they cost too much and they should be subsidised if you are a british passport holder and work within the feild of reference you wish to acquire, if they were £50 per part then they would sell like hotcakes, i just dont understand the bsi, in the usa they produce the hand book for ceramic tile installation every year ,this gives guide lines and specifcations for the american standards it costs around $12, why we dont have that here is beyond me, hope this helps
gary

Thanks mate, not trying to decry BS, but as you say the availability & cost puts it out of reach of the people who should be following them.

 

[White Room]

Can't answer your question fully but do know a court of law would be looking at the BS standards if any problems accure. My girlfriend used to work at BS and was on the double glazing side of it and every year the window companys have get their products tested on the glass to carry the kite mark and there are so many court cases because the companys are not upto scratch on the on getting their glass tested every year and still print the kite mark on their materials.

 

[Leatherface]

Perhaps we could do a poll?
Who purchases & keeps and updated copy of BS5385-4:2009 for reference

 

[Rob Z]

Here is the book that Gary mentioned...it's not perfect but it is a great start for all of us in Canada and the US that care about the tile trade. It is not law, per se, but it is definately considered to be an authority and judges and attorneys will reference it when there are disputes.

The handbook is usually updated every two years.

TCNA - TCA Publications

I think the price went down from last year. The order form says $10. I think I paid $12 the last time.

http://www.tileusa.com/MasterWebForms/PDFs/LitOrderForm0908.pdf

 

[Leatherface]

Here is the book that Gary mentioned...it's not perfect but it is a great start for all of us in Canada and the US that care about the tile trade. It is not law, per se, but it is definately considered to be an authority and judges and attorneys will reference it when there are disputes.

The handbook is usually updated every two years.

TCNA - TCA Publications

I think the price went down from last year. The order form says $10. I think I paid $12 the last time.

http://www.tileusa.com/MasterWebForms/PDFs/LitOrderForm0908.pdf

Thanks mate, will have a look !

 

[White Room]

Just a link to help people know some idea whats the cost http://www.bsi-global.com/en/Shop/Publication-Detail/?pid=000000000030043518

 

[Rob Z]

Nick,

One thing that I like about the TCNA handbok is each method of installations is detailed with a very precise and labeled drawing (a section in architect's terms), with written description of all steps, materials, tolerances, etc. I have been able to use the details in my contracts rather than write out everything -I just say "Will install tile as per TCNA Spec # XYZ..." It is quite handy for the contractor, and very specific about the work that will be done.

 

[White Room]

That should be the standard here but payment is allways due for information, WHY