Water UFH Tile moving and grout breaking - Tile Advice

[procastinator]

Hi fellow forum dwellers, am a distraught customer looking for some advice.

We did an extension and got water pipe UFH installed throughout the ground floor close to 100sqm. The WFH was left to dry for 4 weeks before the tiling was commissioned. We purchased glazed porcelain tiles from TilePlus in Oldbury. The store were made aware about the UFH. The tiler was a recommendation and we had seen their work. The work that I saw was on a standard floor (no UFH). The tiling was done in July and no care was taken to ensure no one walked on the tiles before the tiler said so. We moved into the house in first week August. The tiles felt good to walk on. Once the cold started kicking in (around Oct/Nov), we followed the instructions provided to start the UFH and increase the temp by 1 degree.

In Nov I started noticing the grout broke but ignored it as it was just the one tile. As the months went by the grout came off from other places. Noticed tiles making noise as I walked over them. Started with a couple and now I have a floor of tiles that are making noises at various places. Called the tiler and the store to let them know about the issue. The store have passed on my details to the company that manufacture the adhesive (Palace Chemicals). Currently waiting for them to call me.

The tiler got defensive and is blaming the adhesive and UFH material. I am afraid that he is going to shrug any responsibility on this. I did pay cash (some via bank transfers) so don't have a VAT invoice of the work before anyone asks.

Where do I go from here? Any pointers will be appreciated.

 

[Anthony]

What type of screed was it? Did the tiler ask you? I’ve just chopped up a floor on top of ufh,yet again

 

[Anthony]

It sounds like a poorly prepared calcium screed. Sorry this page is jumping all over the place

 

[procastinator]

Hey @Anthony thanks for the reply. Am trying to find out the details of the screed. I had it written down but changed phones so lost some of the messages. The tiler, the supply company all were made aware multiple times of the UFH system.

 

[Anthony]

This is on water fed ufh. This was done 2 years ago by someone else, if the floor is not sanded,and primed twice the tiles will eventually de-bond,this still happens regardless of ufh.

 

[TKD Tiling]

There are multiple reasons why this could happen, I don’t think you’ll find the answer on here.

 

[procastinator]

Hi @Anthony I suspect that to be the case. I am so stressed. All that money for tiles and tiling down the drain. Everyone will get defensive and pass the blame to the next person.

 

[procastinator]

There are multiple reasons why this could happen, I don’t think you’ll find the answer on here.

Thanks for the input. I was hoping to know common causes from peoples experiences.

 

[MrKnowItAll]

Hi, Lots of possibilities, but with a bit of investigation, solvable...if you lift several tiles and the screed is cracked, then its the mix of the screed thats caused the unbonding...What was the room temperature when the tiles were fixed, hopefully above 5 degrees C the whole time, otherwise the adhesive wont bond... depending on type of screed, was it prepared/primed properly?..depending on size of floor, are there expansion strips in the appropriate places...Are there expansion gaps around the edges?..Possible adhesive mfg problem, but for the adhesive and grout to both unbond would be unusual..That is pretty much all I got.. Good luck...

 

[MrKnowItAll]

Oh and maybe dust on the backs of the tiles...Adhesive doent stick well to dust/dirt

 

[Tiler Bristol]

Preparation hasn't been done correctly for whatever reason but it can be investigated and solved. This looks like a good read if you haven't seen it Do Tiles Crack With Underfloor Heating? - besthomeheating.com - https://besthomeheating.com/tiles-crack-underfloor-heating/?utm_content=cmp-true

 

[MrKnowItAll]

Assuming the adhesive and grout used was suitable, ie. Flexible!

 

[procastinator]

@Anthony and @MrKnowItAll - So the floor that was put down was anhydrite gvylon liquid screed floor.
My suspicion is that the tiler didn't apply a primer to the floor before putting down the tiles.
Leaves me with 100sqm of f*ck up. And the tiler won't admit his mistake. He will say I didn't supply him with the primer.

The grout and adhesive used was suggested by TilePlus was a Palace Chemicals standard stuff. They aren't accepting that wrong advice was given when they were told what sort of floor it was being tiled on.

 

[Alex121212]

It sounds like a poorly prepared calcium screed. Sorry this page is jumping all over the place

Yep, I’m getting it jumping all over the place too.
Makes reading more than 1 comment almost impossible … not a great 1st impression of the site …

 

[Alex121212]

@Anthony and @MrKnowItAll - So the floor that was put down was anhydrite gvylon liquid screed floor.
My suspicion is that the tiler didn't apply a primer to the floor before putting down the tiles.
Leaves me with 100sqm of f*ck up. And the tiler won't admit his mistake. He will say I didn't supply him with the primer.

The grout and adhesive used was suggested by TilePlus was a Palace Chemicals standard stuff. They aren't accepting that wrong advice was given when they were told what sort of floor it was being tiled on.

Was everything else supplied to the tiler? I.e. adhesive, tiles, grout, silicone etc … was the tiler asked to supply anything himself?