Advice on porcelain tile movement. Grout coming out of tiles. - TilersForums.com

[Wonkyfloor]

What’s happening with the UFH, are they installing more on top of this?

With what they have done with the No More Ply indicates they have no idea what they are doing so I would stop any further work if I was you.

It really annoys me when “tradesmen” try to get out of their obligations with part refunds, if they are not competent then a full refund should be given. Better still they shouldn’t attempt the work in the first place.

Yes they said tiler will be here Monday to do ‘his bit’ whatever that means is anyone’s guess at the moment as I wasn’t told. But what I was told, are that the joiners are planning on putting new heat mats down on Monday night. But at the moment no work will be happening as I need answers. Based on all this information I’m gathering now from all of you, I feel a bit more confident in holding my own and not basically being shut up as if I don’t know what I’m talking about.

 

[Wonkyfloor]

get whoever is going to do the work, or even a new tiler to do a complete method statement, materials and fixing method. Then take pics as the job progresses.

Thank you I will ask for this tomorrow morning. As it stands just now it seems no more work will be moving forward while the floor looks like this!

 

[Wonkyfloor]

It's probably getting tight to get things sorted properly before Christmas as I think you need to stop this work now and get a proper refund which may mean getting legal.
I'd put some cheap cord carpet over those boards, enjoy your Christmas with your family then attack this with renewed vigor in the new year.
You didn't pay the original "tiler" directly so your contract isn't with him, it's the project manager.

It’s all down to money rather than doing the job right but to me. But going with everyone’s opinion on the work so far it’s not going to work and will just cost them more to end up doing it right in the end. I don’t know how this works but surely if money is genuinely tight on his part for repairs and he’s having to cut corners then he should have some sort of insurance that could be claimed for the funds needed for the work?

 

[Boggs]

Stick to your guns on this.
The only way to ensure this is done correctly is to remove everything back to original sub floor.

If it’s No More Ply being used it must be installed as per the instructions provided here.

If it’s Hardie Backer then see here.
https://www.jameshardie.co.uk/import/Documents/HardieBacker Product & Installation Guide.pdf

Any levelling compound used must be suitable for timber floors.

Tiles should be fixed with notched trowel and back of the tiles to be back skimmed to aid adhesion.

Good luck.

 

[Time's Ran Out]

@Boggs - I think there is a lot more to it then your post!

 

[Wonkyfloor]

UPDATE
I have just phoned tiler for an update on this situation and asked why we’re not back to a bare floor. He advised me that the joiner is saying it would take days to remove all existing slc etc. So when that option was removed the next best solution was to use a concrete based board screwed in with 40 something screws to lift the floor. He has advised joiner that he will have to review floor once boards are down for stability and that we will hear cracks just now because of the existing adhesive underneath. Told him I understood why I could hear cracking as all of that was still underneath that but I could actually feel movement in a specific board and he’s coming out tomorrow as planned to review. He said if the floor isn’t stable then it has to go back to the joiner and decide wether that means lifting it all or using a suitable compound which will secure it. He said he will not waste his or our time laying the tiles if it isn’t going to work so not to worry. I also asked about his method for adhesive which he told me he definitely doesn’t do dot and dab method, he trowels it on the floor and then backskims the tile and also all materials getting used will be flexible.

 

[Time's Ran Out]

It would have been just as easy to have lifted all the old adhesive on the 6mm plywood. Even to have levelled all the floor prior to fitting the No more ply. But unless you use the expensive tubes of adhesive with NMP, tape and mechanical fixings I don’t see a satisfactory outcome!

 

[Wonkyfloor]

It would have been just as easy to have lifted all the old adhesive on the 6mm plywood. Even to have levelled all the floor prior to fitting the No more ply. But unless you use the expensive tubes of adhesive with NMP, tape and mechanical fixings I don’t see a satisfactory outcome!

He’s told me they boards don’t need taped or joined with adhesive and that no more ply and hardiebacker are the same thing both concrete based boards. Sorry again for bombarding you but I’m just wanting to be fully armed and ready for them all arriving tomorrow. Another concern I have is how high my floor will be sitting at the end of this if they continued with this job and put the underfloor heating on top then a compound on top of that.

 

[Time's Ran Out]

It’ll be about 25-30mm finished height.
I looked at a job last year where NMP was used on walls and floor - the walls cracked at 800mm high ( the same height as the boards width) inadequate support at the join meant slight movement transferred through the tile face! It’s the only board I know of that doesn’t recommend taping the joints, saying the ultra strong glue is all it needs. It wasn’t so in my view and since you don’t have any specified fixing method ( loose laid boards on a unprepared sub base ) with no glue under or between boards and screws without washers - well it’s going to fail!!
And they are not the same! Hardie is my preferred board.

 

[Wonkyfloor]

It’ll be about 25-30mm finished height.
I looked at a job last year where NMP was used on walls and floor - the walls cracked at 800mm high ( the same height as the boards width) inadequate support at the join meant slight movement transferred through the tile face! It’s the only board I know of that doesn’t recommend taping the joints, saying the ultra strong glue is all it needs. It wasn’t so in my view and since you don’t have any specified fixing method ( loose laid boards on a unprepared sub base ) with no glue under or between boards and screws without washers - well it’s going to fail!!
And they are not the same! Hardie is my preferred board.

Thank you so much your knowledge again is helping more than I can express in words. The finished height is going to make it sit way to high compared to existing downstairs WC floor tiles and bifold door runners, which will look ridiculous because there was already a height difference first time round so this is going to be even more noticeable. I’m thinking my best option is tomorrow to tell them to rip everything up right down to the floor boards as this is just heading straight for another tiling disaster! I’m basically getting rid of a problem to create another one in its place by the sound of all the information I’ve got from the forum.