Lippage clips... charge or not?

[Italy]

Now Mark & Lee - you wonder why I don't frequent Forums too often? People who know nothing about me or my work coming out with stuff like this. As Bill O'Herlihy used to say (Irish members will know him),
'we'll leave it there'

For me, you can be also the best tiler in london,
But what you said above does not change my opinion.
If you are afraid of beginners, because they can use leveling clips.
I'm sorry, but I think you do not really believe your possibilities.
I just said what I think,
without doing a lot of laps with useless words.
Good morning

 

[Andy Allen]

Can't say I've ever used them...
Although they do seem to be very popular now.
I can remember when they first came out and someone on here did a review .....think it was Gary.
Then they were torn to pieces about leaving voids, twisting the tiles ect.
So they must of improved a great deal since then.
It's like most thinks if you come into a trade and these thing's are already in place then they are the norm, if you have been doing a job for years then it's hard to change......
I've only just started using a grinder !!
If you can produce a more than acceptable job without them then I don't think you should be criticised for that as you shouldn't be if you choose to use them.
As for them making a DIY'er an expert...then there is so much more to tiling than level clips !

 

[WetSaw]

I suspect in a couple of years time all this debate about clips will be over as they'll become just another "tool" you either use or you don't. I can't see why the people who don't use them seem to get so uptight about them, if you're ( and more importantly your customers ) happy with the work you're turning out then there's not a problem!

 

[Italy]

I criticize only those who come here to pass judgment.
without first having tried. Or have tried a couple of times.
Even apprentices are able to lay flat tiles
And flat substrates.
a real tiler, is seen in moments of difficulty,
Not when everything is flat.
ps.
Even if he had spoken to Pope Francis,
I would have given the same answer.

 

[Andy Allen]

Can I just clarify.......what are they actually for...?
Bent large format tiles.
Uneven substrate .
To avoid lips due to adhesive shrinkage.
Any more ?

 

[Italy]

Can I just clarify.......what are they actually for...?
Bent large format tiles.
Uneven substrate .
To avoid lips due to adhesive shrinkage.
Any more ?

try them, is now

 

[LM]

Can I just clarify.......what are they actually for...?
Bent large format tiles.
Uneven substrate .
To avoid lips due to adhesive shrinkage.
Any more ?

IMO they help straighten out bent large tiles, particular planks.
On a substrate that isn't perfectly flat you can have two tiles beside each other both with full coverage but there may be 1-2 mill of difference in height, by raising the low tile and pressing down on the high tile you split the difference and clamp it with a clip until the adhesive sets.
The same logic applies to adhesive shrinkage.
There are many other uses for them that you learn the more you use them, like clamping tiles above windows etc.
All of us professional tilers can lay tiles level with a solid bed, the correct use of clips simply speeds the process up with confidence that the tiles will be in the same place as you left them when you come back to grout them.
In the wrong hands they can of course lead to failures due to incorrect adhesive bedding etc, but a grinder in the wrong hands can be a disaster also.
For those of us who are defending they're use we are simply sharing what we find to be a positive advancement in tiling tools.
Personally my heart would sink at the thought of having to revert back to tilling large formats without them.

 

[Blunt Tool]

Another tool in a tilers tool kit is not going to make us all extinct, years of experience does not get replaced by a piece of plastic! If Joe Public buys them then good the more in demand , the more manufactured, the more the price comes down! If they disappeared tomorrow no big deal!

 

[Joe Clinton]

Correct, I worked with quality tiles - no bowing. Your answer on the bowed plank effect makes sense. It's the first time anyone has offered me a reasonable explanation as to why clips might be used. On the few occasions that I have asked, I've been shouted down. If you are referring to large, large format - no it's not a markert I have any intention entering - not for me, I've done my time. But I can understand their uses there. Mostly Victorian work for me over the last few years. But back to my comments about the clips. I see them sitting in prominent retail positions at the likes of CTD and I do fear the impact they may have on the trade. Plus there's the solid bed fixing issue on floors but that's another story. One prominent retailer said to me - 'yep, you are right to be worried about solid bed fixing but why should I care' - he was loaded with booze at the time

On larger format ceramics you cannot not use them and get a job you'll be happy with, we did some 1000x330's that were bendy as ote on the walls and use the clips and it bends the tiles into place while they set. Definitely no use and more time consuming on small tiles, but as you use them more they become second nature and it's just that guarantee that on a floor if your packing out a bit you know for sure it's not going to move or sink at all, (yes if your coverage is right it shouldn't anyway but we've all had a tile we weren't happy with the next day thinking I didnt leave it like that)

 

[Andy Allen]

IMO they help straighten out bent large tiles, particular planks.
On a substrate that isn't perfectly flat you can have two tiles beside each other both with full coverage but there may be 1-2 mill of difference in height, by raising the low tile and pressing down on the high tile you split the difference and clamp it with a clip until the adhesive sets.
The same logic applies to adhesive shrinkage.
There are many other uses for them that you learn the more you use them, like clamping tiles above windows etc.
All of us professional tilers can lay tiles level with a solid bed, the correct use of clips simply speeds the process up with confidence that the tiles will be in the same place as you left them when you come back to grout them.
In the wrong hands they can of course lead to failures due to incorrect adhesive bedding etc, but a grinder in the wrong hands can be a disaster also.
For those of us who are defending they're use we are simply sharing what we find to be a positive advancement in tiling tools.
Personally my heart would sink at the thought of having to revert back to tilling large formats without them.

An excellent explanation Lee ...