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Discuss Cracked and debonded floor tiling in the The Welcome Forum area at TilersForums.co.uk.

  1. Sico31

    Sico31 New to TilersForums.co.uk

    Location:
    London
    hi

    I am new to this forum. Wanted to get some advise if possible.

    I had a new tiled floor laid a couple of years ago. The tiles have started to crack soon after completion and are now a complete mess.

    The floor build up is a timber hoist floor spaced at 300mm centres with 18mm ply board 10mm marmox Board electric underfloor heating mat. The bit that looks odd to me when lifting the tile there is 40mm of adhesive which is all cracked and loose. Most of the tiles have debonded from the adhesive too.

    Seems to me that 40mm of tile adhesive is crazy.

    Can anyone give advise on if this is normal and what would be the best way to remedy.

    Some photos too

    Many thanks

    0B745AEF-5E42-4DB4-8521-063A4981650D.jpeg FC4E56D9-ED28-4297-BDB8-AB61C01FF092.jpeg E1C28032-727E-4F54-8356-261151612A83.jpeg
     
  2. impish

    impish Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Preston, Lancs
    Very few (if any) tile adhesives are made to go thicker than 25mm.
    That's the issue.
    To be honest; anyone stupid enough to use that thickness of adhesive has probably done many other things wrong too which may have contributed.
    Tiling direct to the mats is one.
    I can see the adhesive ribs, so not back-buttering and bedding the tiles properly is another.
    A job should last a decent length of time (7 yrs or so) can you get legal with the "tiler"?
     
  3. Sico31

    Sico31 New to TilersForums.co.uk

    Location:
    London
    Thanks for the quick response.

    That is interesting to know. What would you recommend to fix it. The annoying part is the kitchen is fitted on to the tiling and it would need to go back at the same height.

    Could you recommend a build up.

    The floor was laid a while ago so I doubt it. I will be approaching the builder though who employed the tiler.
     
  4. pdc

    pdc Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler

    A bit hard to tell from the photos but it looks like a few different layers, possibly very thick levelling compound rather than adhesive. It's wrong though whatever it is.
     
  5. Ajax123

    Ajax123 Tilers Forums Pro - Screed Advisor Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Lincolnshire
    That's not 40mm adhesive it's a screed. Possibly anhydrite although looks too dark...
     
  6. impish

    impish Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Preston, Lancs
    Looking more closely, the adhesive is a separate layer. Well spotted!
     
  7. Waluigi

    Waluigi Top Contributor

    Location:
    UK
    Am I missing something, it’s white Adhesive and a screed. Would’ve taken an age to heat up.
     
  8. Localtiler

    Localtiler Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    Yorkshire
    It looks to me like a thick pour of SLC and then adhesive on top with a tiny trowel like a 6mm. I can tell it's got issues with the amount of gaffa tape over the wires. It's probably a catalogue of errors leading to this point.
     
  9. Sico31

    Sico31 New to TilersForums.co.uk

    Location:
    London
    Thanks for the reply’s. Would anyone have an ideas remedy?

    As I said my kitchen sits on top of this build up so it needs to remain this height but obviously the screed/adhesive needs to come up. Could I ply it out replacing the electric heat mat on the ply and then tile on that?
     
  10. Waluigi

    Waluigi Top Contributor

    Location:
    UK
    You have to ask yourself why it’s that deep in the first place. My guess is that thickness is there because it’s a lower point.

    I’d get everything up and potentially level the floor up with a self leveller capable of coping with that thickness then a sizeable thickness insulation board, then UFH then latex and then tiles

    I don’t do many concrete floors though so perhaps someone else could advise.
     
  11. jcrtiling

    jcrtiling Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler TTA Member Top Contributor

    Location:
    Salisbury
    Do not introduce ply to this job . Although you may not think it you have a good background to start with ie your lower level of screed . Introducing ply will add a later if weakness and complication. It will be very hard to do this properly with the kitchen in place although getting back to that height shouldn't be an issue . As said above after clearing out old flooring and screed or whatever it is . First job level the floor . Then fix insulation boards ( thickness for thickness they are usually cheaper than building up with levelling compound ) .once boards are fixed fit under floor heating then level over that to protect it , get a better wrap of material around the cable got better heat transfer and also if you damage a tile in the future you have more chance of replacing it without damaging your ufh and then finally tile the floor .
    Do not let a builder do this as they are not up to it . After all would you let me build your extension .
    Good luck .
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. LEE MAC

    LEE MAC Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner

    Location:
    BELFAST
    Looks to me like they’ve used a leveller that obviously can’t gobthag deep or cope with ufh. As stated above don’t introduce ply to the mix. Set datums and level up, underfloor heating must be fully invaded in leveller.
     
  13. marbleman

    marbleman Professional Tiler

    Location:
    surrey
    The problem I have is how does anyone get away with doing a job like this
    Surely there was site control on the contract so many issues with this floor installation I am amazed it stayed down so long
    I wish the customer would check the installation before commencing there is a world of information online and this is a good place to start
     
  14. jcrtiling

    jcrtiling Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler TTA Member Top Contributor

    Location:
    Salisbury
    My customers don't know what materials in using in fact it you went into some shops the staff don't know what they are selling . So even with the internet with no experience they are just going to get confused.
    It's like when we had central heating installed in a house we had . We had to sign off on a xxx btu boiler x btu rad etcetera . I would been happier signing of on something that said , i will install central heating and your house will be warm when it's cold outside .
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. marbleman

    marbleman Professional Tiler

    Location:
    surrey
    i am truly sorry your customer has had this happen to them and I understand but there is good sites out there that will put you on the right path regarding installation issues
    A construction engineer would be a good start as plans would draw up of the correct installation how and what is to be used but I do understand this costs money but then you have drawing so it could be signed off before any tile is installed
    We have used construction engineer for years with flooring issues and never had any issues
    Maybe that’s where you start
     
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