Tiling onto warped worktop

[Martino]

Hi i went to view a job a few days a go..Kitchen splashback. the worktops were solid oak. but the joiner has only oiled the topside and not the bottom. hence major cupping/warping...only option would be to shape the tiles to the worktop...how much gap would you guys reccomend 4mm?.....was thinking of reccomending a upstand to start and then tile off that but not sure if i would get the finish the same as the worktop..

any ideas?

 

[White Room]

How much has the work top warped, have you put a straight edge on it to see how bad it is.

 

[Brian the Tile]

i dont think there is a way of making a silk purse out of a pigs ear personaly,i wouldnt get involved and if you do get them to sign something to say its not your fault that it looks a mess

 

[Martino]

I have explained to the customer that tiling wont hide how bad the worktop is....i also asked if she wanted to change the worktops. she dont want to change them. maybe going to but the microwave in its place!!...need the extra cash atm so i want to do the job.was thinking of just siliconing a 3mm joint underneath......its wapred around 4-5mm and its biggest point

 

[CJ]

Is a couple of metre splash back really worth the hassle.

 

[Martyn Leeds]

What are the tiles? Maybe start with a cut to work with the slope, if its do-able, 3/4's or so. Bit of messing about but if needs must

 

[Rookery]

It may be that once tiled, the bow in the worktop will be even more obvious. I'd want the worktop replacing.

 

[Stef]

I have solid wood work tops & I tiled on top of a 3mm spacer,
Never got round to siliconing the joint, kitchen fitted over 2yrs ago..

Could you not screw the work tops down into the units from the underside!!

I know it's not the done thing but it surely would be better than the warped work tops.

 

[DHTiling]

Oiling the underside ... never seen that done..?

 

[Stef]

Oiling the underside ... never seen that done..?

When I purchased my work tops I was advised to oil all sides.
I put 5 coats on top & 4 on the bottom.

They are a pain in the backside, I'm looking to change them to Corian or something else..

 

[widler]

Oiling the underside ... never seen that done..?

Me neither ,I've got oak work tops,just done the top,been in around 4 years now as well,no warping at all,they are defo screwed underneath as well though

 

[Stef]

Me neither ,I've got oak work tops,just done the top,been in around 4 years now as well,no warping at all,they are defo screwed underneath as well though

You not had any bother with them screwed down?

I know they have to breathe, I was paranoid to fix them to the units.

 

[AliGage]

I fitted solid oak worktops a number of times and have never oiled the under side. Only the overhangs of the doors or anything that might be on show.
Where is the dip? Is it over a unit or a free standing appliance?
I've also always screwed my tops down. You use angled brackets with slotted holes to allow for any slight expansion.

 

[lmkitchens]

Should be oiled underneath when fitted about 5 coats.

Shouldnt be crewed tight either, 6mm hole and lightly tightened to take up the tension!

 

[widler]

You not had any bother with them screwed down?

I know they have to breathe, I was paranoid to fix them to the units.

Not at all,seem fine, maybe my tiling is holding em down

 

[AliGage]

Should be oiled underneath when fitted about 5 coats

I'm interested to know, for what purpose would you oil the undernath??

 

[John Benton]

I'm interested to know, for what purpose would you oil the undernath??

It will be to counteract the oil on top to stop it curving

 

[lmkitchens]

^^ balances the worktop. Stops it cupping.

 

[Colour Republic]

The undersides should always be oiled so moisture resistances is equalised all around, this is the reason they are cupping. Moisture is entering the underside and expanding the wood, on the top where moisture is less due to its protected state from the oil is not expanding at the same rate. Hence cupping. In addition they shouldn't be screwed tightly down but have slip plates installed. The worktops will expand and contract as it is a natural material so will pull the cabinets in all sorts of directions if hard fixed.

Personally I wouldn't tile it no matter what but if she won't listen and is too going to do it any way then I would suggest you leave a large 6mm expansion gap so the worktops can twist and bow even more.

 

[AliGage]

I've always used the "slip plates" as you mention but i've never oiled the underside of the worktops. This is what I was taught.
Having said that two kitchens for customers I have installed with solid oak tops in the past I am still in contact with. One is the owner of the garage I take my motors to. His kitchen I installed some 8 or 9 years ago. There's been no cupping there, and it was the 28mm tops. Being slimmer you expect it to be more vunerable to cupping surely?

 

[Colour Republic]

It makes no odds Ali, the thinner ones don't need to take on so much moisture to warp but then they won't warp which as much force and the fixings could keep it down, it makes no odds, if its going to warp, it's going to warp!

Count yourself lucky yours didnt warp. Just like a tiler saying I dot and dab floors and 'I've never had a problem' doesn't make it acceptable practice. All timber should have the reverse side protected if the face is to be decorated or covered. Have you ever seen decking cup? What abou T&G cladding? As I say better to equalise all timber and protect from moisture just like you would do when laying ply before tiling

 

[AliGage]

Hardly think the comparison to dot and dabbing tiles was either necessary or the same thing.
As I said it was how I was instructed/shown to it. Merely questioning because I have never done it.

 

[Colour Republic]

How is it any different Ali? Something is either bad practice or it isn't, not oiling the undersides of timber worktops is bad practice, whoever taught you must have known no different, all the people that dot and dab must have been shown by somebody else. How many floors have you taken up and then found they were dot and dabbed despite not outward signs it was? It's no guarantee a floor will fail as some just get lucky. So the comparison is perfect.

I'm not calling you a cowboy just saying not oiling is bad practice and you'll find most timber blank suppliers will state the underside needs oiling prior to installation.

 

[AliGage]

I wasn't arguing either way. Just asking why

 

[The D]

OMG are you really being advised to walk away from job over a 4mm discrepancy ?? Where have all the real men gone

 

[DHTiling]

OMG are you really being advised to walk away from job over a 4mm discrepancy ?? Where have all the real men gone

I agree .. some will walk away from anything but perfect :lol: ... oh the joys of internet tilers..

 

[Colour Republic]

It's not the unlevelness that is the problem it's the fact the worktops will continue to warp and crush the tiles, the tiling isn't the issue its the worktops. Hence the reason for leaving a big expansion gap if you do tile it.

 

[Martino]

Colour republic has got it down to a T....my origional post was asking about what size gap to leave...No doubt these worktops will continue to bow and warp. If i dont tile it someone else will...she knows what can happen and wants it doing anyways. I am proborbly going to leave around a 4mm gap as thats the largest tile spacer i have and silicone it......Dont no why peoplle get these oak worktops they dont even keep good!...not to mention quite ugly...My own opinion lol....With regards to a few posts in this thread. i have fitted quite a few of these tops and always oiled the underside..reasons that colour republic mentioned perfectly.

 

[widler]

Colour republic has got it down to a T....my origional post was asking about what size gap to leave...No doubt these worktops will continue to bow and warp. If i dont tile it someone else will...she knows what can happen and wants it doing anyways. I am proborbly going to leave around a 4mm gap as thats the largest tile spacer i have and silicone it......Dont no why peoplle get these oak worktops they dont even keep good!...not to mention quite ugly...My own opinion lol....With regards to a few posts in this thread. i have fitted quite a few of these tops and always oiled the underside..reasons that colour republic mentioned perfectly.

I admit they are a pain in the backside ,the wife wants to oil them every bloody minute to make them look new may thats why mine aint warped, all the pigging oil has soaked all the way through, cos i tell you lot something, when the eldest daughter washes up, its like she has been diving in the sink !