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Discuss Is this ok? Natural stone floor not level after tiling in the Tiling Forum area at TilersForums.co.uk.

  1. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    IMG_8717.JPG IMG_8718.JPG IMG_8720.JPG IMG_8721.JPG IMG_8724.JPG IMG_8733.JPG IMG_8734.JPG hi guys

    recently had a new bathroom tiled in our new loft conversion . Tiles were laid on top of ply but were told latex would be put underneath to level the floor? There was definitely something put down before adhesive that was left overnight. But now it's finished the tiles are not level at one end of the bathroom floor. Also the natural stone tiles to me look dirty now and now they have been sealed they are like that now for good? Or am I being too picky? If I'm right can the tiler do anything to remedy or myself, other than the obvious start again!
     
  2. Andy Allen

    Andy Allen Metro specialist & forum entertainer! Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    Gloucester
    Grouting looks terrible.
    Was it sealed before grouting?
     
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  3. widler

    widler THE Troll Wannabe Professional Tiler

    Location:
    England
    Looks a bit ropey if im honest, defo needs a good clean.
    BUT it looks like he has sealed it after grouting ? Or sealed it again after grouting and sealed grout dust in :(
     
  4. 3_fall

    3_fall Administrator. Staff Member Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    SW London
    A flat floor is one thing and a level floor is something completely different.
    If your finished floor is flat and not causing any issues for you, then whilst it may not be exactly what you expected, flat is acceptable generally.
    It does look like it's been left in an unacceptable state tho.
    Yes it can be remedied, first you would need to give it a deep clean with something like Lithofin Power Clean or Wexa, diluted as instructed, then left to thoroughly dry for a few days.
    Then you can re-seal it with something like Lithofins Stain Stop, this will give your floor protection from everyday stains.
    There are also daily care products that can extend the life of your seal. And of course you can top up the seal whenever you feel it is necessary.
    Here is a PDF explaining the cleaning and sealing process

    If any of the above info is incorrect I'm sure @Lithofin BOB@Lithofin BOB can put you right.
    I wouldn't panic yet tho.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 22, 2016
  5. timeless john

    timeless john Trusted Advisor Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    North East England
    Looking at that level you could have a 2 inch step into the room if it was to be level. It's not the 'Tilers' fault for the substrate levels and it may be flat.
    If indeed it was a 'tiler' who did this work it's been left in unacceptable condition. Get him back to rectify and delay payment till your happy!
     
  6. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    Great advice, thanks a lot. The tiles are marble would using the lithofin chemicals be ok with this? Regrout before sealing again?
     
  7. 3_fall

    3_fall Administrator. Staff Member Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    SW London
    Lithofin will have the correct chemicals yes.
    Power clean is more suited to marble I think,
    @Lithofin BOB@Lithofin BOB will be exact, and he'll almost definitely be on at some point this evening or very early tomorrow. Creature of habit is our Bob!;)
    Getting it clean is the first stage.
    Leaving it to completely dry will be the next, even if it takes several days.
    THEN re-seal, follow instructions to the letter!
    Do not cut corners or have a 'that'll do' approach.
    Then you can re-grout. You can make that call when you have it at that stage. If you do re grout, you will need to seal after that as well.
    Good luck.
    And wait for Bob :)
     
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  8. hmtiling

    hmtiling Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner

    Location:
    Isle of Wight
    Are they fired earth 'east Hampton' tiles?
     
  9. ATSDiamondTools

    ATSDiamondTools Official Member Support Company Support

    Location:
    Surrey UK
    They look like a low grade Carrara Marble (low simply meaning they are more grey than white) used to create a mosaic.

    If they have been recently laid (last day or so) they may still be retaining moisture from the grout/adhesive which gives them a darker appearance (grubby looking almost).

    If a dark adhesive has been used rather than a white adhesive that will also darken the marble.

    If they've been sealed, they may have been sealed too soon, locking in moisture and darkening the stone.

    If you look at the edge of each hexagon, they are sawn and the edges aren't eased or finished in any way so you can see chipping along all six edges of the hexagon. This is highlighted once it's grouted. They don't look well manufactured to be honest.

    How long ago was the job completed?
     
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  10. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    The tiles are fired earth bridghampton and the job was "finished" 8 days ago. I've held back a third of the money we agreed, but still he isn't cheap! We were recommended this guy as we wanted a top quality job, doesn't seem like we've got one at the moment. He also retiled our other bathroom, ceramic tiles over the current floor tiles I think that looks ok. Ceramic tiles though probably an easier job
     
  11. antonio

    antonio Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    italy
    Think same
     
  12. Lithofin BOB

    Lithofin BOB Company Support

    Location:
    Hampshire
    As ats, these tiles may have been sealed to quickly , possibly trapping moisture .
    If fired earth, These tiles are advised to be laid, left a minimum of seven days or until fully dry , these should then retain there original colour ,then impregnate , minimum 12 hrs curing and grout- second application after grout is fully dry

    I would adive to release the impregnator in a section or the whole floor to see if this will dry, if so stripp ,leave until colour returns, if it won't these may have water marked/ stained and this may be iriversable , Then we can clean back with the power clean if it require further cleaning for dirt and other contamination.

    Are they from fired earth?
     
  13. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    Yes they are fired earth bridghampton
     
  14. Lithofin BOB

    Lithofin BOB Company Support

    Location:
    Hampshire
    Was a rapid set adhesive used?
     
  15. Lithofin BOB

    Lithofin BOB Company Support

    Location:
    Hampshire
    Was our mn stain stop used to seal?
     
  16. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    I'm not sure to be honest. He took 5 days to do both bathrooms. This bathroom also had a shower cubicle to tile inside and one wall with metro tiles. The first day he put the "latex" down. Don't know if the time scale can give you any indication if which type of adhesive he would have used
     
  17. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    I don't think so on the stain stop I didn't see it in the house
     
  18. Lithofin BOB

    Lithofin BOB Company Support

    Location:
    Hampshire
    As well as the adhesive moisture ,we have the latex moisture to release through the tile to.
    I would stripp a section, we have a product wax off. If you or fitter want to discuss the runthrough in morning , give me a call on our tech line
     
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  19. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    Thanks a lot BOB will give you a bell tomorrow. Much appreciated everybody! Will keep you posted on the final look if your interested
     
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  20. whitebeam

    whitebeam Moderator Staff Member Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner

    Location:
    Hertfordshire
    Always want updates....
     
  21. andy8758

    andy8758 Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Somerset
    Reading a post like this could tempt me to switch to Lithofin (from ...a). Excellent advice Bob.

    My problem is finding a retailer locally that stocks the full range. One local supplier did not have Wexa (thought you guys all used steam cleaners nowadays), and the ones who do keep 1 litre bottles (5 makes so much more sense to fixers using it all the time). Another retailer wanted to sell me Stainstop (natural stone sealer) for sealing a Victorian floor. So can you supply us direct, without setting (e.g.) a £1000 minimum order?
     
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  22. whitebeam

    whitebeam Moderator Staff Member Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner

    Location:
    Hertfordshire
    I think Lithofin do day courses, might be mentioning to Bob next time hes on.
     
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  23. timeless john

    timeless john Trusted Advisor Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    North East England
    Despite all the excellent advice, you don't want to be doing anything to this floor yourself!
    Get back to whoever recommended this tiler and ( if it was Fired Earth) get them to have a look at it.
    He could have already ruined your tiles but if you try to undo his mess he will just walk away with two thirds of your money and you'll have no recourse to pursue a claim.
     
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  24. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    He was recommended by our plumber and I know him through my dad who is a builder
     
  25. timeless john

    timeless john Trusted Advisor Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    North East England
    So it's your Dads fault - for putting the floor in out of level and recommending a tiler out of his depth.
    Us Dads get all the blame and we're only trying to help.
     
  26. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    No he's a brilliant help! I'm a dad myself!
     
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  27. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    My dad definitively didn't know the tiler, and not impressed by the recommendation !
     
  28. Stef

    Stef Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Cumnock, Ayrshire
    Have you not got a CTD close to you?
    I use lithofin & if you ever need any help then they are just a phone call away.
    I was hoping to meet Bob at Harrogate at the weekend but they weren't there.
    Hope the Op gets this sorted as those tiles aren't cheap..
     
    • Like Like x 1
  29. WaltWhite

    WaltWhite Member of Tilers Forums

    Hi all just had a very useful chat with @Lithofin BOB@Lithofin BOB and sent some pics to the fired earth technical team. Hopefully can be sorted

    I was wondering about the toilet, the pan is not level due to the floor. My dad thought maybe use rapid set but then was told could stain the marble tiles. Any ideas?
     
  30. DrJogo

    DrJogo New to TilersForums.co.uk

    Location:
    Oxf
    Natural Stone should always be sealed before being laid. This avoids the problem of dirty tiles. The PH balance of the sealant will help protect against acidic chemicals.
     
  31. Lithofin BOB

    Lithofin BOB Company Support

    Location:
    Hampshire
    Welcome to the forum , firstly
    We ( lithofin) and standards ( standards state with caution)would not advise Natural stone to be
    Impregnated prior to laying as this can trap moisture ,leading to discoloration ,mineral salts trapped ,oxide issues, water staining ,refere to the photos above
    I get 5-10 of these a week.
    No sealer or impregnator on the market is resistant to acidic damage and will break down with the use of these types of product.
     
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  32. timeless john

    timeless john Trusted Advisor Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    North East England
    Now having fixed a few stone floors over the years I'd put my 6d worth in.
    White Limestone, Terracotta and Encaustics I always seal as I take them out of the crate. Honed stones I work clean ( not as clean as my son apparently) and seal when fully dry 48 hours later.
    This particular marble I would have worked clean but sealed before grouting.
    Not that anyone listens to old people these days.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  33. Lithofin BOB

    Lithofin BOB Company Support

    Location:
    Hampshire
    I think your right John , if you are familiar with the stones and techniques fine. but, people are getting bitten with so many variants of natural stones these days , example, slate , residues of grout , 25 years ago ,we would just wash over with a diluted hydr ( brick acid) In my book now I have 18 different slates/ mud stones that can react differently , you can't use acids on them they bloom with oxide with hydocloric ,some react with alkalines , some will highlight ,go white with solvent based sealers ,so water based required,
    If you pre seal, some some will produce mineral traces and you can't get the out. floors are being taken up.
    I can be a bit negative, all I deal with is problem floors or were sent in to sort them out.Wednesday I had 550 Sqm pre sealed piatra cerana sandstone, all discoloured and is coming out, gutted it was beautifully laid .Information is key, possibly from the supplier, and the knowledge we gain .
     
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  34. andy8758

    andy8758 Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Somerset
    I always refer directly to the supplier when fitting natural stone. I treat the stone according to their instructions. However, some suppliers give duff information. e.g. a well known national stone supplier telling a customer to use floor polish on the slate in their bathroom. So I treat the advice with some caution, but generally if they recommend a particular sealer I use it.
     
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  35. timeless john

    timeless john Trusted Advisor Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    North East England
    But look at all the issues that occur from suppliers recommendations.
    Terracotta has all but disappeared, Black limestone being used in locations unsuitable and builders thinking that this job is easy!
     
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