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Discuss Dittra mat not sticking down in the Tiling Forum area at TilersForums.co.uk.

  1. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    i have a level sand cement screed floor and used Ardex x7r tile adhesive to stick down Dittra mating. It went down very well felt and looked good. Until my leg caught the corner of the matting and lifted it up a little bit, I then noticed that there was no bond strength between the matting and the adhesive. I very slightly pulled on the matting and it all came up very easily with no adhesive residue on the underside of the mat.
    I then decided to take it all up.
    I then carried out a test where I left the matting down until the next day where it dried, I pulled on the mating again it had not bonded.
    I have tried with other adhesives and I cannot get the Dittra to stick, it just pulls up.
     
  2. Martyn Leeds

    Martyn Leeds Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Leeds
    For me, X7R is a very rapid rapid. So perhaps its skinned over before its been stuck..

    Then you've used other adhesives, so maybe you're mixing it too stiff ??
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Albert

    Albert Professional Tiler Top Contributor

    Location:
    Gateshead NE8, UK
    Adhesive needs to be really wet
     
  4. Tony73

    Tony73 Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler JOTM Winner

    Location:
    acton w3, london
    As above. Wet adhesive.
     
  5. callatiler

    callatiler Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    Aberdeen
    As above needs to be fresh and wet, mat needs to be pushed down with trowel or vinyl floor roller, most powder flexi adhesives need days to fully dry before ultimate strength is achieved and I wouldn't be trying to pull mat up before then.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Thanks to everyone fir your replies, yes x7r is very quick, but it has not skinned over. I have used x77 and rapid flex from nicobond and others.
    I have mixed up the adhesive quite wet as well and stuck down samples.
    When I place the matting on the adhesive the adhesive sticks to the matting but when the adhesive dries it comes off the fleece leaving no residue.
    I have used Dittra before and it feels good going down, I have never tried to lift it until now.
    If anyone is interested I suggest you stick some pieces down as a test and see how easy they lift off.
    I don't think it ever sticks down it is just bedded in.
     
  7. Protiler 68

    Protiler 68 Professional Tiler

    Location:
    South east/kent
    Make the adhesive to wet ,6mm trowel then sticks like rubbish ,i use a piece of 4x 2 to push down all over
     
  8. Chris Gibbs

    Chris Gibbs Professional Tiler Top Contributor

    Location:
    North wales
    I had the same problem. they recommend a 4mm notched trowel, but personally I found a 5mm better. sounds daft I know but the notches are further apart and the bed stays wetter a bit longer. worked for me anyway. I'm not actually a fan of ditra, much prefer the durabase stuff. now that sticks!
     
  9. Sean Kelly

    Sean Kelly Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Ruislip
    Ardex AF200 and a roller is all you need. No need to prime the floor, but if you do, then you have to wait till it is really dry. AF200 should come with a free trowel, but a 3mm will be just fine. Stick down the mat and go over it a few times with the roller. Then tile straight away (i.e. the glue is tacky for hours, but you can tile straight away).

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  10. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Sorry it don't stick irrespective of how wet the adhesive is, if you use a 4x4 trowel it lays more flat. Have you ever tried to lift it?
     
  11. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Yes AF200 is very good and that sticks it down very well,mug it's only meant fir wooden floors and it cannot deal with water. If you say have a washing machine leak it will all come off
     
  12. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    When the Dittra is cut to length and the adhesive is spread straight away and laid there is no open time issue.
    Thanks
     
  13. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Does it stick, ?
    Try putting a sample down and see how easy it comes up,
    I would be very interested to know
    Thanks
     
  14. Sean Kelly

    Sean Kelly Trusted Advisor Professional Tiler

    Location:
    Ruislip
    I disagree Marios, It is suitable for all substrates and is recommended by Schluter.
     
  15. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    I have tried mixes with different consistency and I the same, I have even tried buttering the fleece it looks good but then when the adhesive dries it just comes off, I would have expected it pull off the fleece
    Thanks
     
  16. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    I would have loved it for you to be right Sean,
    I spoke to anther tiler friend of mine who said the same as you, so I contacted Ardex technical who told me it is not really meant screed and it don't cope with any kind of water. I told my tiler friend that and his reply was ******** it does cope with water and he suggested I put it I water. I had a sample stuck down by Colin at Ardex technical, it was stuck down very well, I could not take the matting off without tearing the fleece, I then put it in some water for 4 hours and it unstuck very easily.
    I therefore cannot chance in putting it in a kitchen because a leak from a washing machine and it all up
     
  17. TheAofT

    TheAofT Active Member

    Location:
    North London
    Totally agree with Sean Kelly.
    Ardex AF 200 is the best solution for fleece based decoupling membrane especially on wooden floors. Easy to apply and ready to go out of tub. Save so much time on preparation and you can tile straight away. Just make sure that floor is completely dry and dust free. 3-4mm trowel plus roller for large scale or grout float or anything flat to press it down and you're sorted.
    Good luck...
     
  18. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Very sorry it should have read 'but it's only meant for wooden floors NOT mug that was the spell checker sorry
     
  19. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Thanks for rely, Ardex technical stuck some down and they had the Sam problem
     
  20. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Yes you are right for a wooden floor, but on screed floor it must be totally dry because any bit of moisture will break it down. It's the same kind of stuff we put Altro non slip flooring.
    If your laying it on a concrete or screed floo I suggest you use a damp meter on the floor first.
    I also suggest you do a wet floor because if the washing machine or dishwasher leak it will break down. I have spoken to Colin at Ardex technical and he is the man who developed it.
     
  21. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Hanks for your reply it still don't stick
     
  22. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Thanks for your repl but it still don't stick
     
  23. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Thanks fir your reply it still don't stick
     
  24. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
  25. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    I layer 10 m2 and it all came up with no residue of tile adhesive on the underside of mat

    image.jpg
     
  26. TheAofT

    TheAofT Active Member

    Location:
    North London
    Ok Marios,
    I've been using AF 200 for years and never had any issues with either wooden or concrete floors.
    Water ingress will affect anything on floor or walls and if you so concerned about leaksor moisture, there is the only one solution which is complete floor waterproofing like wetroom or swimming pool but at its own expense.
    Good luck...
     
  27. callatiler

    callatiler Professional Tiler JOTM Winner Top Contributor

    Location:
    Aberdeen
    How long did you leave it before you did your pulling up stunt?
     
  28. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    The 10 meters were only down for an hour or so, I did not want to risk the adhesive going totally hard.
    But the pictures above where the matting was stuck down on the paving slab and on the piece of ply, we're stuck down by Ardex technical the previous day, and bought to my site, they were down for about 24 hours and they came off just as easy and leaving no residue.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  29. Protiler 68

    Protiler 68 Professional Tiler

    Location:
    South east/kent
    If just putting 3mm down floor got to be very good
     
  30. Adey1980

    Adey1980 Professional Tiler Top Contributor

    Location:
    Caerphilly
  31. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Yes you are right, af200 sticks down good and it is recommended.
    But what is winding me up at the moment is that Schluter recommend and show a cement based adhesive in their specification sheet, and I cannot, nor can anyone else based on the replies, get it to stick to the fleece.
     
  32. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
  33. marios

    marios Active Member

    Location:
    England
    Thanks for all your replies
    It seems that no one can confirm sticking Dittra down with a cement based adhesive and confirm that it has stuck it is just loose laid/bedded
     
  34. Schlüter-Systems Ltd

    Schlüter-Systems Ltd TF Official Sponsor

    Location:
    Leicestershire
    @marios@marios call the office on 01530 813396 and ask to speak to the technical department.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
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