Travertine and adhesive?

[Gustyturbine]

Hi Guys,
This is my first post so take it easy.
I am self building at the moment and love the look of Travatine. I have had quotes from 2 local guys but as cash is tight towards the end of the build I am going to do it myself. I have tiled before all be it with ceramic tiles and the results have been good.
My question is that if I buy a full tile sample from Travatine direct and the Tile and bath company will the tiles be the same quality as the sample. The Tile and Bath company have given me a sample and it is very good, the ones they have in their show room are terrible though, mostly filler. They say at the moment they are getting much better quality.
Also any opinions on the Tile and Bath company Grant adhesives? They say the Blue flexible bag adhesive is very good? Travatine direct sell Bal adhesive so I know it is very good.
What are the opinions of tiles on 22mm chipboard. I have fitted easi joist and screws are 6" centres. Floor deflection is minimal so would this be OK with good adhesive and grout? I want to avoid ply if possible so I do not have a step up into the room,
Thanks guys,
Gusty.

[Sir Ramic]

Can you explain "minimal deflection"?...You should be aiming for No deflection.

[Rich]

As above, any deflection in the floor will cause problems and chipboard is not a suitable substrate to tile onto, you will need to replace it or over board.

[widler]

yep,over board ,don't tile over chipboard. and deflection wants to be nil with trav,i find its very soft

[Dave]

Samples of Travertine.. all you get normally is a 100mmx100mm square off cut.. this bears no resemblance to what a full tile will look like.. there is quite a lot of low grade Travertine coming from certain uk suppliers and they say it is first grade when in-fact it is far from it..

My supplier will not entertain low grades but as well , you get what you pay for usually
..

So beware of just going by that small sample.

As for the substrate..?.. then the lads are advising fine.

[Gustyturbine]

OK thanks guys. So ply it is then. If I am correct 15mm should be fine? What do you do to hide the edge though? Can you get an edging strip to cater for a drop of 15mm+adhestive+tile? How does the drop look?
Dave- I have collected a full sample from the "Tile and Bath company". It looks good in all fairness and the guy said the quality was good at the moment. The tiles they had on the wall in the show room however looked like a wall of filler!
I was thinking of gettinf a full sample of the "Premium Ivory" from Travatine Direct. It will cost £35-00 for carriage but I figure it could be money well spent. What would a good price be for decent travatine?
Am I alos correct in thinking that flexible adhesive and grout is the only way to go? Is Bal still the best?
Thanks in advance,
Gusty.

[Gustyturbine]

Thanks all for the information.

[Gustyturbine]

Dave- I have a full sample from the Bath and tile company and it seems very good. The guy said that at the moment the quality was higher than normal. The tiles on the wall in the display looked like 90% filler.
So if I was to fit ply on the floor at 15mm then I would have a drop of about 1". How do you hide this? 15mm ply+adhesive+tile would be about 1".
So regarding adhesive, is Grant blue adhesive fine or is Bal still the best?
I am also going to order a full sample from Travatine Direct to check the quality.
Thanks guys,
Gusty.

[whitebeam]

I'de also be using a decoupling membrane for the travertine.

[Rich]

You could remove the chipboard and replace with 18 or 22mm BWP ply then over board.

[Rich]

I haven't used Grant adhesive so I will let somebody who has advise on this.

[Gustyturbine]

Hi Whitebeam,
So I assume that the decoupling membrane allows the tiles to expand and contract at a different rate to the floor?
Thanks,
Gusty.

[grumpygrouter]

Hi Whitebeam,
So I assume that the decoupling membrane allows the tiles to expand and contract at a different rate to the floor?
Thanks,
Gusty.

correct.

[Gustyturbine]

Thanks Grumpygrouter,
How do you avoid having a step up into the bathroom though? I guess you cant unless I lift the chipboard and fit ply?
Gusty.

[charlie1]

The most important thing is how its fitted, you could get trav at 20 m/2 fitted by a pro who will take pride in his work or you could spend 35 per m/2 and make a bum of it! I know what instalation I would rther have!

[Gustyturbine]

Charlie1,
I agree. My problem is that the 2 prof tilers that have quoted for the work have both said that trav on chipboard with flex adhesive is OK!!!!! No confidence in them now. I will need to shop around a bit more. Anyone know of a good tiler in the Aberaeron area? I did think my quotes where quite high. Do large open room cost less to tile than awkward bathrooms? Does anyone travel for work?
Gusty.

[Rich]

If you send a private message to Dave, he might be able to help you find a good tiler in your area

[whitebeam]

You can do a new post here I'm Looking for a Wall and Floor Tiler

[Dave]

I don't know anyone in that area.. though quite a few guys will travel.

[Gustyturbine]

Thanks all. If anyone is interested in the work then I could email my plans through to you. Just forward your details?
Gusty.

[Gustyturbine]

Hi again,
I have just been jumping up and down on my bathroom floors (14 stone just after dinner). I do not think I get any deflection as such. If I put a glass of water down I just get a small ripple. I would imagine that if I fitted a decoupling membrane I might be ok, what do the experts feel?
Gusty.

[Rich]

Always a good idea to use a decoupling membrane although it will not sort out any deflection in the floor, the floor must be solid before the membrane goes down.

[grumpygrouter]

If you are only getting a small ripple in the glass of water then you have a pretty solid floor. As you plan to use travertine then a decoupling membrane is a must for me, oh and overboard your chipboard with 6mm hardie or similar first.

[Gustyturbine]

Thanks Grumpygrouter. I guess you mean hardboard @6mm? What is a decoupling membrane like to fit? I honestly feel the floor is stiff enough but I do not want any future problems. If a decoupling membrane will help then I will fit 1 for sure. what makes are best or are they all similar? Thanks again,
Gusty.

[Sir Ramic]

No not Hardboard !!... Hardiebacker board ( cement tile backer boards)

[Gustyturbine]

Sorry Sir Ramic but I am laughing my backside off at my hardboard question!!!!. I will look into these boards as I have never heard of them before. Thanks.

[Gustyturbine]

So do you fit these boards instead of a decoupling membrane? It looks like the main point of these boards is to give a sound surface to lay tiles on? Gusty.

[Rich]

Thats right, have a read through the link below, might give a bit more info on the backer boards. As said above the decoupling membrane allows the floor to expand and contract at different rates to the stone and the backer boards give a brilliant surface to tile onto, neither will add any strength to the floor but will help make the installation last.


Plywood floors...

[Gustyturbine]

Rich,
Many thanks for the info. So if I was to fit these Hardiebacker boards or similar cement boards with Bal flexible adhesive and Bal grout I might be OK? Would you take any other precautions?
Gusty.

[Rich]

Rich,
Many thanks for the info. So if I was to fit these Hardiebacker boards or similar cement boards with Bal flexible adhesive and Bal grout I might be OK? Would you take any other precautions?
Gusty.

Bal adhesive will be fine, I use Mapei products and couldn't recommend them enough. If there is a tile giant near you I would have a chat with them as you may get a better price. Have a look through the link below and see where the nearest store is.


Mapei: Tile Giant Store Finder...


Here is some info on Hardiebacker boards. Just be aware that if you use another brand then the installation methods may change, make sure that you read through the instructions and follow them to the letter. As long as you have the floor deflection free (sounds like you have) and you use the right materials (sounds like you are) and follow the manufacturers instructions, you should be fine.


HardieBacker...


You say that you have tiled before but only with ceramics, there are a few differences with using stone. After you have fitted the cement boards and the uncoupling membrane, you will need to fill the holes in the uncoupling membrane with adhesive using the flat side of your trowel, then spread the adhesive with a half moon trowel. Then you need to "back butter" the back of each tile with adhesive with the back of your trowel (in the same way as the un coupling membrane) and then press the tile into the bed of adhesive with a twisting motion. It is very important to make sure that there are no voids under the tiles. You will need to work very clean as stone is easily stained, keep a bucket of clean water next to you and clean off any adhesive straight away.
Might be worth doing a search on here and having a read through some threads related to tiling with stone