waterproofing ????????????

[jay]

waterproofing whats your view on this
waste of time
needed
to expencive
not needed
just a general question just interested in your views on it

thanks

jay

placed it in tiling forum for general opinion

[Dave]

IMO..100% needed and should be enforced.. through BS5385..

[chrisroe]

if you dont have it i dont tile it

[mikethetile]

it should be a given

[Stewart]

Been years since I tiled a shower without it........

[Daz]

IMO, every situation has to be assessed.
I recently tiled the en-suite and bathroom for a retired couple. He prefers to shower, she prefers to bathe. I discussed tanking but I could not really justify it to them.

Conversely, I tiled a shower room for a family of five, who all prefer to shower so I insisted on tanking or I wouldn't tile it.

And a third scenario, I will be tiling a wetroom for a couple next week but the builder (for some bizarre reason) has formed the shower walls with ply. I, again, insisted that it had to be tanked prior to tiling.

I think tanking has it's place. In situations where it is obviously required, it is easy to justify the on-costs. It's the 50/50 situations which become harder to justify.

[Dave]

IMO, every situation has to be assessed.
I recently tiled the en-suite and bathroom for a retired couple. He prefers to shower, she prefers to bathe. I discussed tanking but I could not really justify it to them.

Conversely, I tiled a shower room for a family of five, who all prefer to shower so I insisted on tanking or I wouldn't tile it.

And a third scenario, I will be tiling a wetroom for a couple next week but the builder (for some bizarre reason) has formed the shower walls with ply. I, again, insisted that it had to be tanked prior to tiling.

I think tanking has it's place. In situations where it is obviously required, it is easy to justify the on-costs. It's the 50/50 situations which become harder to justify.

BUT.. IYO should it be made law..?

[jay]

it should be a given

Dont understand

[Daz]

BUT.. IYO should it be made law..?

One word..........YES!

BUT.....could it be enforced? You would have to get a buildings inspector out prior to commencing tiling. Not gonna happen IMO.

[Dave]

BUT. and i mean BUT if it was made LAW then it will be enforced as you will have to register every installation.. Tilers version of gas safe.

[jay]

Or like down here you sighn off on waterproofing stating what was used and must be sighned before occupancy certificate is issued

[badger]

shower area should always be tanked imho

[mikethetile]

sorry Jay

it means it should just happen as a matter of course , there should be no debate about it or selling it to the client, every area that is intermittant wet should be tanked to protect the substrate against water ingress

as Dave rightly says it should be a part of bs and be the minimum standard for tiling and anyone not waterproofing an installation should be liable to prosecution for endangering the householders property. it sounds draconian but if you entered someones home and damaged it you would be liable to be prosecuted fpr criminal damage

[Daz]

There are loads of individuals that are having boilers, ovens etc installed by non Gas Safe engineers (I am in the process of purchasing a buy-to-let flat and the survey has highlighted that the new boiler is unsafe for use due to incorrect installation). They accept the "risk" for a significant discount.

If tanking was law, and administered as per Gas Safe industry, I think the general public would look to "other" alternatives to save a few quid.

Gas or carbon monoxide poisoning tends to be a bigger influencer than an insurance claim due to water ingress in a shower?

Sorry to be a negative influence (I would like to see this as a lawful requirement) but too many (and not just the pikeys) will try to cut costs in areas that they don't see death as a possible consequence.

[Daz]

Or like down here you sighn off on waterproofing stating what was used and must be sighned before occupancy certificate is issued

How does that work in a shower re-tile situation? Where the domestic customer has the option of selecting a "private" tiler (or DIY) to improve their shower area?

[Dave]

OK, as in all trades there are cowboys who operate with no certs..

BUT would you as a tiler be ok to be assessed to be certified to install shower tiling jobs etc, and this is not to daz but all fixers..

Should the UK tiling market be certified..?

[ifindoubtgrout]

depends on ones budget.. wetroom yes, domestic shower no for me

[Dave]

depends on ones budget.. wetroom yes, domestic shower no for me

If a domestic shower is used more than once or twice a day then how do advice to avoid water ingression..?

[mikethetile]

anyone who is not gas safe who even disturbs a live gas line or service is liable to prosecution and if lives or lost or endangered the sentance is custodial

when I was jobbing I would get two or three calls a year from people wanting me to reconnect blackballed gas appliances, I started refusing then after talking to corgi reg plumber I used to look at the condemnation sheet, often it was a simple matter of increasing the ventilation to the boiler area and the gas board would reconnect for a small fee

[jay]

How does that work in a shower re-tile situation? Where the domestic customer has the option of selecting a "private" tiler (or DIY) to improve their shower area?

If it's a building requiring occupancy cert they must have a waterproofing form sighned by tiled
It sort of wipes the hands of the local council
So if something goes wrong it goes back to tiler
A builder can sighn off for you but he wears it

[mikethetile]

OK, as in all trades there are cowboys who operate with no certs..

BUT would you as a tiler be ok to be assessed to be certified to install shower tiling jobs etc, and this is not to daz but all fixers..

Should the UK tiling market be certified..?

simple answer...................yes

its not just tiling, all trades should be certified

[Stewart]

Should the UK tiling market be certified..?

Yes...... And the sooner the better!

[Daz]

If it's a building requiring occupancy cert they must have a waterproofing form sighned by tiled
It sort of wipes the hands of the local council
So if something goes wrong it goes back to tiler
A builder can sighn off for you but he wears it

I hear what you are saying Jay, but, what about the situation when the occupant has been in the house for many years and wants a shower refresh? They are not moving home, just improving part of it, does it still need the waterproofing to be signed off?

[Daz]

Should the UK tiling market be certified..?

I wish

[jay]

I hear what you are saying Jay, but, what about the situation when the occupant has been in the house for many years and wants a shower refresh? They are not moving home, just improving part of it, does it still need the waterproofing to be signed off?

sorry captain mis understood

if its a reno requiring no council approval yes it can be skipped but most of the tilers down here waterproof and the ones that dont make work for us (full rip out and re do ) and there name is mud very quickly

[Ceramica Tiling]

I always sugest tanking to our customers ,give them the pros of having it and cons of not. Guess what 80% of the time they would rather not pay the extra for tanking and take the risk. Saying that using acrlyic primer and ardex never had a comeback.

One builder used to fibreglass the ply and varnish ply on the floor too! never had a leak on that

[Scott]

I think there are far more things that should be inforced before waterproofing, but thats just my take on it. I have done plenty without it that are still fine and dandy.

The problem with any enforcement is the punishment isnt harsh enough, I know a plumber who fitted a heating system illegally, got caught and fined £2000, thats probably what he earned doing the job in the first place. He went straight out the next day and fitted another one that same as he had been doing daily for years

[Dave]

I always sugest tanking to our customers ,give them the pros of having it and cons of not. Guess what 80% of the time they would rather not pay the extra for tanking and take the risk. Saying that using acrlyic primer and ardex never had a comeback.

One builder used to fibreglass the ply and varnish ply on the floor too! never had a leak on that

Tell you what, say next time do you know it is regs now to have tanking,, see the reaction..

[Dave]

I think there are far more things that should be inforced before waterproofing, but thats just my take on it. I have done plenty without it that are still fine and dandy.

The problem with any enforcement is the punishment isnt harsh enough, I know a plumber who fitted a heating system illegally, got caught and fined £2000, thats probably what he earned doing the job in the first place. He went straight out the next day and fitted another one that same as he had been doing daily for years

Scot so have I and many others.. but.. we should now move with the times and offer a 100% water tight installation don't you agree mate or any other fixer agree.. lets get this totally legalised.. lets push to be certified like many other countries are

[Ceramica Tiling]

Yep i always sign off my tanking, being iam a TILESAFE ENGINEER