Guaranteed Work?

[sriel1]

How long a guarantee do you give to customers?

1 year
5 years
10 years?

I guarantee all work although not all products on the market offer lifetime guarantee therefore I was wondering how long is a sensible guarantee.

Any thoughts appreciated...

[mikethetile]

when you give a written quote to your clients you can put your terms and conditions at the bottom of the quote

you can gaurantee against faulty workmanship for one year and have a clause that means they have to report any defect within 3 months of completion

if your going to put in conditions its a good idea to say this does not affect your statutury rights

[united]

I put on my quotes that I offer 12 months as long as I use the materials that I spec for the job, either supplied by myself or the customer

[Diamond Pool Finishers]

two years on swimming-pool finishes!!!

[tiler1000]

When we're either supplying or installing we always make the point of using the best quality tiles and fixing materials. This way we find you can easily give a 4 year guarantee for our work. We always let it be known though that the majority of problems after half a year come from the preparation being sub standard. If the prep is done right with the right materials then guarantees for your work can be used as a really good re assurance to your customers. We usually try to make a point of doing our own prep so we know its done correctly but if some one has bodged the preperation of the surfaces then there is not alot can be done. We make sure all that is written in our T and C on the invoice.

[mikethetile]

just one small point your t&c need to be on your quote too as by accepting your quote they have accepted your terms of trading

if they are on your invoice only they havent accepted them prior to employing you and as such can ignore them

[tiler1000]

Very good point Yes quote and invoice. Having said in the previous post that we are able to give a 4 year guarantee if requested we usually have a standard 2 year guarantee as most customers are happy with that. Like i say though, the horror stories you hear always seem to come from the guys who cut corners or try to make a quick buck.

[mikethetile]

Very good point Yes quote and invoice. Having said in the previous post that we are able to give a 4 year guarantee if requested we usually have a standard 2 year guarantee as most customers are happy with that. Like i say though, the horror stories you hear always seem to come from the guys who cut corners or try to make a quick buck.

your not wrong there tiler and have you have already stated if you do the job right from the start you can offer long guarantees with confidence

another problem is lack of experiance some tilers simply dont know better

[poynton phil]

Could you let me have the information,that i should be putting as terms and conditions, as at the moment i just put all my work is guaranteed for 12 months.

[sriel1]

On the footer of my quotation sheets it states that all work is guaranteed, although doesn't actually state for how long. When I'm asked how long the guarantee is for, I tend to judge the job on its own merits and the condition of the house overall. Houses in need of maintenance could be a higher risk of having problems so if asked I'd give them a 1 or 2 year guarantee - although never in writing. However I'm pretty sure I've lost a few jobs because I didn't give a written guarantees.

[tiler1000]

I always find it best to give them a standard guarantee for my own work but explain that it is just that 'my own work' If your following on from some cowboy builder the first person to be called will be you. As you are supplying the finish this is where the problems will become visible. If you are not confident of the substrate my advice is to either avoid it or get them to sign a disclaimer, as you do have a responsibility to make sure the surface your tiling on to is suitable. As long as you do your job by the book then you can be reasonably confident that any problems that may occur can be explained. I know you mention older 'high risk' properties but new builds can also be a minefield, if a builder has done something wrong you can be certain he'll try blame you for any problems that become visible in the tiling. Worst culprit being trying to floors or walls tiled before fresh substrates have had time to dry out, always find out when previous works have been carried out and use un coupling membranes etc wherever necessary. If they need a written guarantee you can be confident enough to give them it, it's a shame to lose work but if the customer isn't prepared to do it properly to save money then avoid it like the plague, usually the people who'll call you up on it afterwards Hope this helps.

[Wingn]

28 day guarantee.

Don't have one as such, but happy to stand over my work for 2 or 3 years.

[Stewart]

2 years guarantee for tiling, 5 years for wet-room installation. we only tile if we do our own prep. good advice above, about having your terms and conditions on your quote. i always get the customer to read the quote and the schedule of works, then sign off on them before we book a job in.

[Ajax123]

workmanship has to be conducive to offering a product or service that is fit for purpose and remains so for a "reasonable" period.

In terms of statutory rights of customers it make little or no difference what term of guarantee you put on either workmanship or the materials. As a supplier of a specialist product and/or service you have to ensure that the resulting work conforms to what a court would deem to be reasonable.

In terms of tiling being a semi permanent fixture I would have thought a reasonable term would be very very considerably longer than 1 year. If I spent several thousands of pounds on a tiled floor and it failed after little more than 12 months I would have no hesitation but to insist the tiler sorted it out.

I do know that when I supply screeds by implication they have to offer a life expectancy to conform to the reasonable life of the building. I have had to write guarantees in the past for anything from 12 years (Standard PFI snagging term) and 100 years (standard design life for domestic dwellings)

I think I would be a bit insulted and indeed put off my a tiler who was telling me his workmanship and if appropriate his materials were only likely to last 1 year.

[Ajax123]

By the way if you are going to offer conditions of sale and delivery so to speak it is a really good idea to limit your liability to the cost of replacement of materials and labour supplied directly by you.

[Daz]

This is a weird one.
My quotations say that all work is guaranteed, but there is no timescale.
I've never been asked how long my work is guaranteed for.

I agree that prep work will always reflect how long you would wish to guarantee your work, so does this mean that you alter your T&C's to suit each job?

I work on the premiss that if there is a failure and I can prove it is down to the prep / substrate (and I did not do the prep) then I'm covered. If it is my fault, then hands up.

I assume that my work is guaranteed for as long as the customer can contact me (my email, mobile & home number have not changed in over 10 years) so I guess that one day I could get a phone call.

[Ken Bruty]

2 years for me, and I'm proud to say that it has never been exercised so far

[Ajax123]

to use the term "my work is guaranteed" is a non terms really as it does not define the terms of the guarantee. What it does is simply create the perception in the customers mind that the work must be of "good quality". It is really just salesmanship

To offer a meaningful guarantee you need to define the terms. For example I could say my work is guaranteed and then when there is an issue I could say well it was guaranteed to fail. If on the other hand I was guaranteeing that the work will remain sound and fit for purpose for a defined period it becomes meaningfull.

Don't get me wrong I am in now way having a pop at people who take pride enough in their work to guarantee it at all. That is admirable. The issue is that when offering aguarantee as a term of contract it needs to be carefully worded.

My guarantee documents are usually written specifically for each project which I am guaranteeing. I don't often have to do it becaue the products I sell are by implication guaranteed to remain fit for purpose for the life of the building anyway. We use CE certification as the appropriate means of certification of minimum performance.

[andy8758]

Ajax has a point that needs careful listening to. I think some of the other posters on this thread read like they are "cowboy tradesmen" with their cavalier attitude to customer care.

As a Specialist Wall and Floor Tiler - you should be looking to give the customer at least a 10 year guarantee. BUT for such a guarantee, you need to guarantee your work and your materials - so if customer supplies adhesive (that may not be to your approval or from a dodgy source) or the customer prepares the sub-strata (and you can only see the outer part of that prep) then a 10 year guarantee would be foolish - maybe a simple 12 month guarantee would be acceptable.

Again, it must depend on careful wording as part of the T&C.

So come on everybody - dont you think your customer deserves the best guarantee you can give them? Mine do.

[Daz]

Ajax has a point that needs careful listening to. I think some of the other posters on this thread read like they are "cowboy tradesmen" with their cavalier attitude to customer care.

As a Specialist Wall and Floor Tiler - you should be looking to give the customer at least a 10 year guarantee. BUT for such a guarantee, you need to guarantee your work and your materials - so if customer supplies adhesive (that may not be to your approval or from a dodgy source) or the customer prepares the sub-strata (and you can only see the outer part of that prep) then a 10 year guarantee would be foolish - maybe a simple 12 month guarantee would be acceptable.

Again, it must depend on careful wording as part of the T&C.

So come on everybody - dont you think your customer deserves the best guarantee you can give them? Mine do.

I'm not sure if your comments are targeted at me or not, but as far as I'm concerned, my guarantee is timeless. My comments are to illustrate that few customers actually bother to ask what guarantee the work carries, if any.

I will always assume responsibility to resolve a tiling issue and only charge in circumstances that I can prove that it has not been caused by poor workmanship on my part.

I am not a "cowboy tradesman" and I take offence at being labelled as such.

[mikethetile]

how do you gaurantee materials produced by a third party for ten years

you need to be extremely carefull offering warranties as you can find yourself seriously out of pocket through no fault of your own. you cannot gaurantee that an adhesive will not fail and if it did you would have to foot the bill for the entire job

limit your liability to your workmanship as thats the only part of the job you have control over, if materials fail you can go back to the supplier for recourse and sidestep liability

10 yrs is a long time and it would be advisable to get insured if your going to offer that kind of gaurantee

any defects in workmanship should manifest themselves within 12 months

if a job fails at any time due to incorrect methods , materials etc a warranty is immaterial as they will simply sue you anyway

[whitebeam]

Even keep the batch numbers and make of addy in your records just in case

[Daz]

how do you gaurantee materials produced by a third party for ten years

you need to be extremely carefull offering warranties as you can find yourself seriously out of pocket through no fault of your own. you cannot gaurantee that an adhesive will not fail and if it did you would have to foot the bill for the entire job

limit your liability to your workmanship as thats the only part of the job you have control over, if materials fail you can go back to the supplier for recourse and sidestep liability

10 yrs is a long time and it would be advisable to get insured if your going to offer that kind of gaurantee

any defects in workmanship should manifest themselves within 12 months

if a job fails at any time due to incorrect methods , materials etc a warranty is immaterial as they will simply sue you anyway

I totally agree Mike.
Just to play "Devil's Advocate" I looked at a job this evening where the tiles have clearly been D&D'd with no obvious signs of failure other than one small area above the shower head. The customer advised that the tiling was done over 15 years ago and has only recently displayed problems. The issues are clearly because of the incorrect fixing methods in a wet area but have taken a long time to manifest so whilst I agree with your comments, I find it difficult to concur that issues will be identified within 12 months.

[Stewart]

I'm not sure if your comments are targeted at me or not, but as far as I'm concerned, my guarantee is timeless. My comments are to illustrate that few customers actually bother to ask what guarantee the work carries, if any.
I will always assume responsibility to resolve a tiling issue and only charge in circumstances that I can prove that it has not been caused by poor workmanship on my part.
I am not a "cowboy tradesman" and I take offence at being labelled as such.

I'm with Captain Slow on this. I wouldn't like to think that I'm being branded a "cowboy Tradesman" Having had over 20 years in the trade (and most of that with my own business) I find the number doesn't really matter and is normally there just to give the customer peace of mind if they're looking for it.

The true test of a tradesman , is what they do when they gets the phone call, saying they have a problem and how quickly and professionally they deal with it. No matter how long the jobs been completed.

[mikethetile]

thats right captain

if incorrect fixing methods are used then theres no limit to liability , you can be sued whatever the timescale

im assuming that those offering a written warranty are using the correct fixing methods and materials