‘Pay per job-lead’ websites – a necessary evil? or just evil?

[Stan001]

Checkatrade / MyHammer / MyBuilder / Trusted etc. Are they all evil?

I’m glad the subject of Checkatrade etc has come up in another thread. I will be open from the start and state that I really hate the way these companies exist and the principles behind these companies.
These companies simply sell leads to us trades, they generally charge to be on their website then they charge either a fixed fee or a percentage for every job bided or won. They try and hide the fact that they are simply lead sellers by telling the customers / market (and their trade members) that the customers can rate their ‘members’ therefore they are doing a ‘service’’ by ‘driving out the cowboys’.
The single problem being – its mostly very misleading! They are only trying to add respectability and cover to their operations by ‘selling’ this idea of theirs that they are there (for customers and trades) to drive out the cowboys. It’s all a simple sales job. This wouldn’t be so bad but for the fact that the customers are being conned by their claims or checking trades, they don’t. All the time they are running their business for profit their prime reason for existence will be profit.

Customers are not only being conned – they are suffering bodge jobs on a daily basis as they rely on organisations to ‘vet’ trades that have never and could never pass a proper vetting.

I particularly don’t like the fact that Checkatrade allows their system to be manipulated, I really don’t like the fact that the customers have been conned into almost believing they are some form of ‘official’ setup, maybe by local government etc. They advertise down here in the south on local radio and that’s how its presented, if I was a customer I’d believe them to be ‘official’.

There are sites out there (even one run by a major tile addy OEM) that do advertise for free, these sites do not have the jobs traffic that the others do, I know Checkatrade charge over £400 a year to each of their trade members, they are using that money well for Google Ads and search engine optimisation – capitalism wins – the non pay sites can’t do that so are not on Google’s first page if you search for a local tiler etc.
(the other major pay per bid sites are generally charging about £40 every 3 months then upwards of £15 per bid, successful or not)

I have looked through the examples of the trades work on these sites, there’s plenty of total rubbish on there and guess what – its rated highly! Now let’s think about that, why would that be? Well its simple really, if the customers knew what they were doing they’d DIY many of these jobs themselves. They are not ‘qualified’ to rate a trade – except in extreme circumstances when its obvious to anyone that things have gone totally wrong. I fixed a job recently where the ‘tiler’ (who left his materials behind) had put down a floor using really good addy (Mapei) but it was the wrong addy (non flex on a wood floor), and put down the wrong spec ply - after weeks all the tiles started popping – no doubt that trade if he had gone via one of these sites would have been another satisfied customer.

As can be seen on another thread on this forum, you can get plumbers employing / sub contracting the tiling, where is the checking done on those being sub-contracted? Plus we have all seen the profiles of these guys who plumb, tile, do the gardening and fencing, be a chippy, be a man with a van, and are a tiler! (let's ask them what BS5385 is and ask them about some of the basics within shall we!). How do these sites allow this? These’ jacks of all trades and masters of all’ are quite bluntly – liars!

I have read recently that the government will be looking into the activities of these companies and their masquerading as ‘official' agencies (source: Checkatrade was specifically mentioned in Kitchens and Bathroom Review – Trustmark are getting very hot under the collar about them) so I look forward to the day when customers and the trades stop getting ripped off by these companies. I say the sooner the better because as we are in a recession with idle programmers and desperate trades I’ve noticed a new version of these ‘pay per lead’ websites popping up every few months!

So what is the solution guys?
Support the free bid sites and refuse the pay for lead sites?
Try the ‘if you can’t beat them join them’ approach and join up then complain from within?
Start writing articles to local rags highlighting these issues?
Write to forums complaining and making people think?
Write to Trustmark and ask what they are doing and when?
Just accept it because this is capitalism at work and if some customers get stung then so-what?

Please discuss here (yes I know many of the pro's here will say ‘I get all my work on recommendation etc’ but think a bit deeper – pretend your work dries up – then how do you feel ref the above? Think of all the additional work you are losing to these bodgers via these sites – because you are! Think of good customers out there being hurt by this system – it’s not their fault is it ).

I feel so terribly sorry for customers employing poor trades that are hiding behind this cloak of apparent respectability. I also feel sorry for all the professional tradesmen out there doing a good job being affected by this. The only people I see benefitting from these sites continued existence is the site owners and the bodgers. IF they all disappeared tomorrow then customers would simply select via our advertising and ask for references and portfolio’s themselves, or turn to the trade associations who would then have to improve even more on their self policing activities to ensure their badges are worth a damn. ... it’s a good argument for actually banning any bid site that asks customers or trades to pay a single penny to be a part of all this isn’t it!

So what’s the solution guys? Is there a solution?

[Diamond Pool Finishers]

i use different ways to find work

[Stan001]

but gooner - read my posting. ..... a bodger via Checkatrade gets the job to tile your next door neighbours pool, he does a hash job You lost out, your neighbour lost out and your neighbour cant even afford your reasonable fees and excellent skills to fix it. See effects the good trades even if they dont use pay per bid. How do you feel about that?

[LM Ceramics]

its just a way to make money out of work and alot of the jobs posted arent genuine there are many other opitions to explore to find work

[Prem Tiler]

I had some muppet phone me the other day about becoming there recomended tiler in the Burwood area. lol rat spotted as I live in Verwood not Burwood!

They had the cheak to leave a message with my wife saying they were phoning about some tiling they wanted doing. Could I cal them back on this number ********* not a high rate number but miles from me.

I called them thinking it could be gen, got through to a woman receptionest who said I needed to speak with David Brown, Put me through to so fella claming to be a building contractior who takes work on then subs it out for a 2% cut. I would price all my work and could there for over price 2% to cover my losses. The 2% would only be paid once I had received payment.

Ok I think nothing to out of the ordenary, ''go on'' I say. Normally I don't give these chancers the time of day but this fella sounded like he couldn't be bothered to talk to me and this made me think he wasn't selling anything.

He went on to exsplaine how they only have one tiler in any given 10mile radus area on there books and would need 3 refferances they could go and inspect. Again made it sound like he was not selling anything because they normally don't give a monkeys if your any good.

He then slightly muttered he would need a £200 admin fee to be paid up front and it would be re-embursed by them not taking there 2% cut on the 4th job I completed for them.

At this point I put down the phone.

What a waste of 10 mins of my life.

And it cost me £5 odd on my phone!!lol

[Ajax123]

These sites are just parasitic in my opinion. They only seem to get busy in the slack times like the last 12 months because they prey on peoples desperation. You would in my opinion be better off allying yourself to a couple of addy suppliers, tile suppliers, |UFH suppliers etc and trade leads with them. I do that in my business and it helps build relationships and a bit of honour in the business in that if I give a lead to one of my contacts they will pass me one back and we will both ensure that our respective materials are fully supported between us. Works really well....

[Dan]

Checkout the full list of these types of companies. I'd recommend mybuilder.com and myhammer.co.uk type websites that you pay for only when you get the job, plus a small monthly fee to keep quoting as many jobs (I think) as you like.

Tradesmen Directories (Find a Tradesmen Type Websites) - Blogs - Contractor Forum | Construction and Redevelopment Advice for Professional Contractors and Tradesmen)

[wayno1664]

these sites are the biggest con to hit modern day tiling and other trades .
they seem to be getting positive media coverage somehow , probably by paying a bung to the bigwigs at channel 4 .
We certaily need a way to try and put these parasites out of business

[Prem Tiler]

there good for the customer NOT the tradesman. They don't only take £ from our pockets but also drive down prices. There surposed to combat cowboys but from what I've seen its the cowboys that are using them the most. It the tiler/kitchen fitter/electrican/plumber/gardener/pool cleaner/cleaner/farmer/dress makeing fishermen that are benafiting.

[Stan001]

Thanks for the considered responses so far guys. (need more from others for a true picture!)

I wrote the initial post from a UK perspective – but we have regular foreign members on here (from Australia, France, Sweden, the USA, to name a few), do such websites and systems operate in your countries? If so, are they popular and what is the general feeling towards them? I’d love to know if you are more or less regulated (we know your tiling and qualification standards seem better controlled). Thanks.

[doug boardley]

I suppose you could class builders as an "offline" version. They drive you own in price and then charge the end customer premium rate for your services. Is there that much of a difference? Personally I've never even looked at one of these sites, and hopefully won't have to