Help!: Replacing damp carpet with tiling

[oafcmetty]

Hi,

We live in quite a damp part of the country. In our dining room on ground level, we sometimes get water that seeps into the house, making the carpet wet (or soaking wet). This seems to be coming either up through the floor, or in at the base of the wall - not sure which.

The house is very old, so under the carpet is stone, rather than floorboards. We've not taken the carpet up fully, as it's glued down, we've only lifted a corner - so can't tell yet if it's a solid piece of stone, or what.

My question is - if we wanted to replace this carpet with tiles, would we need to do anything special? Would the tiles survive getting damp every now and again?

We're thinking of getting some tiles similar to this: Tiling terra cotta enamelled - brown with nuance - would these be suitable?

Thanks in advance!
Alex

[grumpygrouter]

You will need to get any water/damp issues resolved before tiling your floor, whatever tile type you choose. The ones you have selected particulary will cause problems as Terracotta is very, very porous and will soak up water from underneath like a sponge.

[Terry Cottar]

you need trace the sorce of the damp. i9t is likely if you live in an old house that there is no dpm you would need to get one installed even though you are having tiles fitted because if you dont the tiles will fail as well

tel

[oafcmetty]

you need trace the sorce of the damp. i9t is likely if you live in an old house that there is no dpm you would need to get one installed even though you are having tiles fitted because if you dont the tiles will fail as well

tel

Hi Terry - what is dpm?

[grumpygrouter]

DPM - Damp Proof Membrane.

[chris.tiling]

agreed - unless you stop the damp problem first, you will always have problems in the future. If you go ahead and tile it, the tiles will debond and lift. The will probably discolour aswell (as they will get wet)

[oafcmetty]

What would be the approximate lifespan of the tiles, assuming we went for some hard wearing, non-porous ones?

[CJ]

Oafy.........take note of wot is being advised.

Cure the damp problem first and foremost...............then, and ONLY then, think about tiling. Or you WILL be sorry

[oafcmetty]

Don't worry - I'm listening! Just curious.

[Abstract tiling]

Don't worry - I'm listening! Just curious.

i


ive pm you

[CBTC]

Hi,
We live in quite a damp part of the country. In our dining room on ground level, we sometimes get water that seeps into the house, making the carpet wet (or soaking wet). This seems to be coming either up through the floor, or in at the base of the wall - not sure which.
The house is very old, so under the carpet is stone, rather than floorboards. We've not taken the carpet up fully, as it's glued down, we've only lifted a corner - so can't tell yet if it's a solid piece of stone, or what.
My question is - if we wanted to replace this carpet with tiles, would we need to do anything special? Would the tiles survive getting damp every now and again?
We're thinking of getting some tiles similar to this: Tiling terra cotta enamelled - brown with nuance - would these be suitable?
Thanks in advance!
Alex

Alex, the link should flesh it out a bit for you.
you must live in quite an old building with the slabs laid direct to earth. The ground water level must have crept up in recent times to be affecting you so dramatically. Floor coverings are not going to have an affect on the moisture penetration, and could provide a 'trapped' layer that would make matters worse. Specialist advice required, not DIY !
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Moistu...ms-a0112797060

[oafcmetty]

It's more that we live on a hill, so get occasional run off when there's been heavy rain - not sure if that means we should focus on barriers to entry from outside, or something like tanking the room. I'm a bit out of my depth here

[CBTC]

has to be addressed from outside / under the structure I would think. You need to talk to a builder with experience of old properties with this problem. The types of product used in conjunction with correct methods can be found at wwwsika.co.uk and links to reputable builders at fmb.org.uk

[jddevel]

Although I obviously do not see the actual problem here is a couple of avenues to explore . External remedial work via a "French Drain"- Google it. Internally dependant on the volume of water a an internal "sump" with plastic land drains in -the sump then drained out of the building. If unable to drain via gravity this sump can be drained electrically using pump and pressure switch ( leave access to sump for maintenance) This measure can often deal with "running" water. OR you could just Synthaprufe
Product Page - Ruberoid Building Products
Remember you can solve anything with a bit of lateral thinking EXCEPT your health

[albertjames]

you could still tile the floor using the right adhesive and a fully vitrified tile
i would recommend swimming pool adhesive my self

[oafcmetty]

Ok - back from holiday, and so I've had time to do some experimenting.

I've been out in the garden and liberally soaked the area which has been problematic - buckets of water, continual hosepipe, that sort of thing. Couldn't get it to reproduce the leak at all - which I think is good news?

As it only leaks during torrential downpours (and even then it's only leaked two or three times in the three years we've been living here), I'm wondering if buying some of that sealant paint stuff and resealing all the affected area, will do the trick?

The area looks like it's previously had this done, but quite some time ago, as it's a bit cracked etc.

Once we'd done this we could then go ahead with the tiling - obviously trying to choose some tiles that didn't actively soak up water!

Does that make sense?

[jay]

hi could you get some pics of substrate (floor) as i think that is another issue from what ive read it sounds like you may need a decupling membrane the main prob you have is rising damp and your adh will struggle to keep hold but your floor doesnt sound good pics please

[oafcmetty]

Will do.

Apparently it's bitumen, but will post photos shortly.

[oafcmetty]

Photos, as promised!





The second is the area where we think the water comes in - the paint on the wall (don't think it shows on the photo) is slightly discoloured and bubbled.

[Oli]

Its more likley i would suggest that as you live on a hill it is the water seeping in from the underfloor, into the walls, you need to get a proffesional surveyor it to diagnose the problem IMO it could be one of a number of things,

To answer your earlier question, i would be prepared to guarantee the tiles until i walked out of your house having finished the job, and only if it wasnt raining at the time and it was all done in one visit.

You really need to address the damp issue first.

[oafcmetty]

If it is seepage upwards through the floor, what steps would we take to resolve that? French drains circling the house?

[Oli]

No idea to be honest mate, I cant stress enough that it is really a job for a qualified surveyor, it could be one of many things, and remedied a number of different ways.

Sorry, i know thats not much help mate but the best advice really is get a surveyor in to do a full anaylsis and report, its their field of expertese.

[Stan001]

sorry in advance for the long mail - but i think you need to get to the bottom of your problem before talking tiles ... hold on - here goes ....
You’d be surprised just how many properties are built straight onto dirt, they’ve been there for a very long time too! I’ve just built a house on a ring and beam foundation with 500mm dia piles going 5m into the ground on 7m of clay to satisfy NHBC. Guess what, my immediate neighbours houses are built straight onto that same clay (hundreds of year old houses) with no foundation as such! From memory right now they have stone and wood floors. I have part demolished a bungalow next door to this project and that bungalow has water running under wood floorboards. Life isn’t like the textbooks, that’s for sure. I think for first step you need to google to find a structural engineer in your area, he will advise ref your ground conditions and what you need to do (you’re looking at £500+ for a report). It is possible to incorporate dams into the ground, and land drains that will rid many of your issues. (the land on my build was like a bog until I inserted four land drains). DPM usage really intrigues me, I cant for the life of me see how they work if the water table can rise above them – in fact it might even trap moisture? I don’t know, I’m no expert. I guess you also need good air vents! For the tile choice we may have to accept that old traditional methods work best (probably stone, but as for the adhesion, I’d be interested in what they use – probably nothing!), and for that I’d suggest maybe go and speak to a company that specialises in barn conversions - they must have experience in flooring in buildings with no foundations on poor land. You might also contact / visit the Self Build and Renovation Centre in Swindon The National Self Build & Renovation Centre - By BuildStore , I’ve been there a few times, a whole bunch of experts are there who can advise on the core construction of your renovation plus second fix (like tiling) issues. Foundation companies can also do a test bore for you (again that cost me another £500) and may be cheaper than a surveyor, they have their own surveyors / engineers that specialise in land. (don’t know if you are looking at a long term fix here or just accepting the damp and after the best fix for your current project, hosepipe wont replicate, I bet you have a challenging water table ). If your immediate neighbours don’t have the same problem as you then you may have a purch spring (I think that’s what its called) that’s where water gets trapped in a void (quite often under foundations), easy to get rid of, bore a hole and let it out / drain.
You raise issues that are increasingly topical with more houses being built on flood plains (don’t ask me why or how, I think its nuts). Please keep us all informed. (sorry for the long email / post, sorry don’t have answers just pointers, it would be good to get to the root cause of your damp) … Stan

[oafcmetty]

Some food for thought there Stan - thanks.

In fact, this afternoon I've arranged an appointment with a damp and timber surveyor (BWPDA, CSRT registered), so we'll see what he says! I'll keep you all posted.

I suspect the house is essentially built on dirt - we're the only house for a few hundred metres in any direction so can't check if anyone else has the same problem.

The annoying thing is we're planning on selling this house in the next 2-3 years, so I'm stuck between spending a fortune on it and getting it all sorted, or doing only cosmetic repairs.

[Oli]

It would probably come up on a survey that any potential buyers mortgage company would have done anyway mate.