Hmmm, what do I do now?

[cornish_crofter]

Unfortunately I couldn't take up Dave's advice on my other thread about prepping a rendered and plastered wall.

I did as much as I could, ie remove tiles, loose plaster and make sure that the wall was flake free etc, just as the giudance on the back of the BAL Greenstar.

However, I was left with an uneven wall at the end of this. It was uneven before but having to remove the loose plaster did not improve the situation.

Not having access to anywhere local that could sell me rapid drying plaster or rapid drying tile adhesive (Local builders merchants offered me multi finish, one coat etc but not what I needed), I set about thickenning up the tile adhesive by a dew mm where needed whilst putting the tiles up.

Where the adhesive is thin it has dried out brilliantly, however beds of around 3 to 4 mm are still drying out. The wall was tiled yesterday.

Do I leave it longer to dry out before grouting, or am I just trying to flog a dead horse here?

[grumpygrouter]

What size are the tiles Cornish and was it bucket stuff you used?

[Dave]

You don't want to be packing tiles out with tub gear.....it will take ages to dry ....

Cement based would have been better...can you not get hold of cement addy...you could have patched your walls with that if the rapid setting patch plaster isn't available where you are...

Just a suggestion...

[cornish_crofter]

Thanks guys.

Erm, yes Dave I did remember you talking about the cement based adhesive - maybe I was too focused on trying to find the rapid setting plaster.

The tiles are 8x10, so not particularly big. I've not had a problem packing tiles out before, though to be fair I've not been trying to get such a lot of work done in such a short time frame before. I did 6 hours today, which considering I work part time is unheard of.

Where's this recession everyone's talking about?

[cornish_crofter]

OK

Looking at the situation as it is here now, how long should I leave the tiles on that wall before I grout them?

I could leave them for about 3 to 4 days without any probs.

[charlie1]

Hi Crofter,

As you have used dispersion adhesive with a slightly thicker bed in some parts then you really want to leave it about a week, if you only have 4 days then that will have to do. The addy you used would have been fine if the walls where in good condition but dispersion addy also suffers from shrinkage when applied to thick as it cures by air and dispels the moisture as it cures. You need to source a good local addy supplier where you can get rapid setting cement based adhesive for future.

[cornish_crofter]

Thanks Charlie

At least, from what you say, the situation is not dire - I'm not going to have to be refixing tiles, though if I got organised with cement based addy that may not be too much of an issue.

Would you rate something like the Dunlop rapid set adhesive that is made for floor tiles for this purpose? I used this for my floor tiles about a year ago.

I've been asked to do a wet room in the same house in due course. I expect to be stuck with walls of the same quality and condition. Also, the client is talking about larger tiles, so the tub addy is definitely out.

[Dave]

Thanks Charlie

At least, from what you say, the situation is not dire - I'm not going to have to be refixing tiles, though if I got organised with cement based addy that may not be too much of an issue.

Would you rate something like the Dunlop rapid set adhesive that is made for floor tiles for this purpose? I used this for my floor tiles about a year ago.

I've been asked to do a wet room in the same house in due course. I expect to be stuck with walls of the same quality and condition. Also, the client is talking about larger tiles, so the tub addy is definitely out.

PLease please read up on wetrooms before you attempt to do it.....ask as many questions as you can in the wetroom forum and get well clued up before hand....

[GazTech]

Thanks Charlie

At least, from what you say, the situation is not dire - I'm not going to have to be refixing tiles, though if I got organised with cement based addy that may not be too much of an issue.

Would you rate something like the Dunlop rapid set adhesive that is made for floor tiles for this purpose? I used this for my floor tiles about a year ago.

I've been asked to do a wet room in the same house in due course. I expect to be stuck with walls of the same quality and condition. Also, the client is talking about larger tiles, so the tub addy is definitely out.

I am the Product Support Tech for Dunlop cornish, if it is available to you and you have any questions regarding the product please ask me.....Gaz
Dunlop adhesives and sealants

[cornish_crofter]

PLease please read up on wetrooms before you attempt to do it.....ask as many questions as you can in the wetroom forum and get well clued up before hand....

Yes, I've already eyeballed the wetrooms forum. I've already spoken to Wetdecs over the phone before finding him on this forum

I have a few weeks yet so I've got time.

My first priority is to get this bathroom finished, then we need to choose a wetroom former for the area. I was looking at the Impey products but it seems that others may be suitable for concrete floors.

One other question - I've managed to source some waterproof raid drying cement from Focus. It comes dry in a bucket (I assume it's in a plastic bag) It seems the closest there is to the wickes stuff you mentioned. It says it is suitable for internal and external repairs to paths, cracks etc, plus sanitory fittings and conduit ways for services.

I need to level off the only other solid wall I've got to tile. Would this do the trick?

Thanks

[cornish_crofter]

I am the Product Support Tech for Dunlop cornish, if it is available to you and you have any questions regarding the product please ask me.....Gaz
Dunlop adhesives and sealants

Thanks for the offer Gaz - I may take you up on that. I'll see what responsed I get about this rapid drying cement first.

[Dave]

The patch up plaster i use in suitable for apint finish as well.the rapid drying cement you mention is a fast setting cement for screeds etc...

This is the product i mean... One coat

[cornish_crofter]

So this is similar to the thistle one coat product then?

I'm confused now

I'm looking to level out some walls where the top skim coat has come off and where the wall is not straight.

I just want something that I can level out the wall with really.

This is why I thought the rapid setting cement would do, as it can be used for thin applications - down to a couple of mm.

[Dave]

As long as the product is not a base coat for a finish plaster then it will be fine...

The thistle one..i haven't seen before....so no comment really..

All you want is a product that sets quick and can be tiled upon....

[cornish_crofter]

This is Thistle Universal One Coat.

Thistle Universal One Coat

[Dave]

It says in the pdf that is suitable for tiling too....
http://www.british-gypsum.com/pdf/DS...201%20Coat.pdf

But if using cement adhesive deffo prime first...

[cornish_crofter]

It says in the pdf that is suitable for tiling too....
http://www.british-gypsum.com/pdf/DS...201%20Coat.pdf

But if using cement adhesive deffo prime first...

That's why I was thinking of a cement based filler of sorts. This approach would save my having to prime.

I could just rough up the surface to be levelled out, then apply the fast setting cement to a level surface - wouldn't have to ba smooth coat, the rougher the better, allow to dry and then it would be ready for tiling.

...well that's my theory anyway. If you see any holes in that logic please tell me

[Dave]

That's why I was thinking of a cement based filler of sorts. This approach would save my having to prime.

I could just rough up the surface to be levelled out, then apply the fast setting cement to a level surface - wouldn't have to ba smooth coat, the rougher the better, allow to dry and then it would be ready for tiling.

...well that's my theory anyway. If you see any holes in that logic please tell me

If it was a cement based render you were patching then yes.....but if it was a gypsum plastered wall then you would have to prime anyway if using a cement based patching ...

[cornish_crofter]

I am the Product Support Tech for Dunlop cornish, if it is available to you and you have any questions regarding the product please ask me.....Gaz
Dunlop adhesives and sealants

Gaz

I've got some left over Dunlop Large Format and Natural Stone Adhesive for floor tiles.

Loking at the link you've provided, I suspect this wouldn't do as a filler, as it's not a wall tile adhesive.

Am I right?

[cornish_crofter]

If it was a cement based render you were patching then yes.....but if it was a gypsum plastered wall then you would have to prime anyway if using a cement based patching ...

D'oh!

My head hurts

I've been going round in circles over this problem for days now and it's really getting beyond fun.

I'm not sure what the plaster is, I suspect it is gypsum, thought it's a grey colour, not the pink multi finish that I'm used to

I know I couldn't prime between the tile adhesive and the new cement using PVA but could I be so bold as to suggest using PVA between the rapid setting cement and the existing wall?

The other option I've got is to remove the rest of the plaster in the area to be tiled IIRC there isn't that much left, the old tiles pulled most of it off.

It's not that I don't want to go and get the right primers, it's that there is limited availability of stuff near to me and I really don't want to spend half a day going to get stuff if I don't need to.

[grumpygrouter]

Cornish, contact David at Trade Tiler and get him to ship you out some of his SBR. You will get it by Tuesday and do you priming with this.

[cornish_crofter]

I've got SBR!



Thanks for the suggestion though GG

Having said that if I used the one coat to level it up, then used the Greenstar, then I wouldn't involve cement based products.

[Dave]

I've got SBR!



Thanks for the suggestion though GG

Having said that if I used the one coat to level it up, then used the Greenstar, then I wouldn't involve cement based products.

Wey hey....!!!.....but use the sbr 4:1 ratio with water to get a good bond with the one coat...

[whitebeam]

D'oh!

My head hurts

I've been going round in circles over this problem for days now and it's really getting beyond fun.

I'm not sure what the plaster is, I suspect it is gypsum, thought it's a grey colour, not the pink multi finish that I'm use to

Some gypsum plasters are grey or pink, As far as I can remember Its where the gypsum is mined

[cornish_crofter]

Well today I used the Evostik Waterproof Rapid Setting Cement to level out the wall.

I've greatly imroved the level. Fortunately the customer has got one of those large vanity units going in front of most of the bottom part of the wall so there is quite a large area I don't have to tile, but I did my best to get the rest of the would be tiled area level.

I was a little worried that this wasn't the best product but I went ahead, my spirits were lifted when I noticed the smell when mixed - it smelled rather like the cement based floor tile adhesive I had used in my kitchen.

I first applied a mix of 1:4 SBR and water onto the walls to be covered. This was over both the areas that were bare render and that still had gypsum. I then mixed the product, applied it and levelled it out with a straight edge.

My first mix was a little on the stiff side TBH, and it was tricky to apply. The second mix was just right. It has all adhered to the wall though.

There were a few small areas where due to the lack of thickness, the stiffer mix wouldn't stay but these were about hald an inch in diameter, and as I'm putting up 10x8 tiles I don't see those as an issue. I'll just add a little more adhesive.

I did manage to take out a dip in the wall that was probably a good 5 to 8mm - I was very pleased with that.

Hopefully It'll tile well tomorrow.

[Alberta Stone]

Put a space heater in the area or at least a fan.
that should help speed the drying time along.
I have to do that lots in rooms which are cooler or have little air circulation.
Even my 500 watt halogen worklamp at times has served to cure things faster.

[cornish_crofter]

Thanks

It was bone dry today.

The wall was tiled successfully.

It worked a treat.

Thanks for all your help