Travertine Job

**JoeB** · 04-09-2008

Hey Guys,

Ive landed my 2nd travertine job on a large 1st floor shower room (approx 40m2), the customer wants both the floor and the walls tiled with travertine.

I have a few concerns however!!

1. Both the floor and walls have been lined with nomoreply, the walls I'm OK with they should hold the weight fine IMO. Its just the floor I'm worried about, never having used nomoreply before. Is this going to be a good enough substrate or will something like Ditra matting be needed on top? The nomoreply is layed directly onto the floor joist and there is a underfloor heating system beneath also.

2. The customer has their own ideas regarding the sealing of the honed travertine (as advised from the local tile shop no doubt), they want an initial coat of HG sealer before the tiles are fixed to avoid staining and then a 2nd coat once there fixed and grouted. I would have thought a Lithofin impregnator would be better?? Can this be used before and after fixing though to keep the customer happy?

3. Price wise, I shall be on day rate of £150 but the customer is thinking I should therefore be laying around 4/5m2 per day, I told them this would be unlikely overall because of setting out, cutting and drilling and told them it would be more like 3 m2. Is this a reasonable amount? Ive also been told not to rush! They expect perfection basically and speed.

4. With the floor having a underfloor (piped) heating system beneath the nomoreply.... will Kerraquick or Rapidflex be suitable or will the heating system somehow effect the adhesive?

Thanks in advance.

Sully · 04-09-2008

Joe,

I haven't used nomoreply but as I understand it, it is supposed to be the same strength as 18mm wpb ply. If that's the case, I wouldn't be happy with this straight on the joists. Plus there is travertine and UFH in the equation - I think I'd want 25mm ply onto the joists and then might even consider a tile backer board over that or talk with Schluter. I'd also be talking with MAPEI / your choice of adhesive manufacturer to be getting a 2nd opinion.

I don't use Litofin sealers but an impregnator would be best.

Customer seems to be 'dictating' how you seal it, what speed you work at and possibly questioning your charges before you start? I'd be taking control here or you might get shafted / meet trouble further down the line. Does he / she want a profi to fix it or would they rather have a go themselves? Abandon that day rate, work out a fixed charge and give it to them - that's what I'd be doing.

Andrew

**whitebeam** · 04-09-2008

With the floor having a underfloor (piped) heating system beneath the nomoreply.... How thick are the pipes under the floor???

**grumpygrouter** · 04-09-2008

No More Ply as far as I am aware is designed to be glued and screwed to a subfloor, this is where it gets it's apparant strength from, the glue being essential. To fix straight to the joists will be problematic IMO as it is a cement based board and doesn't contain much to give it structural strength on it's own.

Need to ask some serious questions with the people at No More Ply first before going any further!!

**JoeB** · 04-09-2008

Originally Posted by whitebeam

With the floor having a underfloor (piped) heating system beneath the nomoreply.... How thick are the pipes under the floor???

15mm white pipe.

Also something I forgot too mention the joists have been filled with some kind of cement-free screed..... Flow-Screed i think, never seen anything like that done before especially on the first floor!!(see: www.underfloorheatingscreed.co.uk/)
So im persuming the flow screed will now prevent the timber joists from moving, maybe the nomoreply with Ditra panels on top would be OK?? Else I shall have to insist they have the floor prep'd properly before I even get my tools on site.

**whitebeam** · 04-09-2008

I would'nt think they would have filled the whole joists to much weight, I would get some more solid detail how its been laid and find out who recommended the no more ply

**JoeB** · 04-09-2008

To be honest ive not got a clue what they've had done, i know we were walking around on this stuff as I was looking round because there are no floor-boards down anywhere, so its solid. I know the nomoreply was laid by another tiler several months ago, so that must be where the nomoreply idea came from.

**whitebeam** · 04-09-2008

I wonder if there've tried the heating yet, As far as I know the heating should be tested so if any expansion takes place before any tiles are laid

GazTech · 04-09-2008

If the liquid screed is heated and cooled first to test it, then why not tile directly onto it. As with most pourable or pumped screeds and concretes, a latence may have to be removed from the surface first before tiling. And if it contains Calcium Sulphate (gypsum) then the cement based adhesive have to be separated with primer.

**devonmark** · 04-09-2008

I have used no-more ply many many times over floorboards and chipboard....but never in the way you described, I would recommend it over another substrate but in the way you describe....I don't think so..well not for me..Mark.

Sully · 04-09-2008

Originally Posted by JoeB

To be honest ive not got a clue what they've had done, i know we were walking around on this stuff as I was looking round because there are no floor-boards down anywhere, so its solid. I know the nomoreply was laid by another tiler several months ago, so that must be where the nomoreply idea came from.

Joe,

You really need to find out the full spec of that sub-floor before you can determine what methods would be suitable. I wouldn't take any risks with UFH or it could prove very costly indeed.

Good luck.

Andrew

Sully · 04-09-2008

Joe,

You really need to find out the full spec of that sub-floor before you can determine what methods would be suitable. I wouldn't take any risks with UFH or it could prove very costly indeed

.

Good luck.

Andrew

**Alberta Stone** · 05-09-2008

I agree that you should look into this further.
Phone the no more ply company and ask them what they recommend.
I have never seen CBU used as a primary deck as it is designed to be mortared and screwed onto a primary deck.
It is a good material to work with but you should prime it so that it doesn't suck all the moisture out of your mud so quickly.
That way you have more time to fuss with it and get it right.