take on an apprentice

[LM Ceramics]

i had a phone call a lad asking if he could i wanted an apprentice it felt abit weird being a 20 yr old lad being asked if i wanted an apprentice anyway he said he tried alot of firms and they all said no i have been tiling 4 years on and off due to the shortage of work i know how hard it was to break into the tiling game i dont know whether i could afford a full time apprentice but i was considering a part time apprentice can they be benifical i know when i was an apprentice at 16 i was useless and thick and just a pain in the ass. im sure all of them aint like me

has anyone on here got an apprentice? any comments appreciated

Lee

[bigandy]

i have had a couple over the years unfortunately one was family and could nt get up!(i only ever sarted at nine so not exactly early) he was a good worker and could have had a future but insisted on turning up late.the next thought he could tile after a couple of weeks with me needless to say fell flat on his face took a week to do five meters in a kitchen,he then asked me to go and sort it out(had to rip em and start again)but his has never put me off i would look again.

btw the best one i ever had was the misses!!!she still helps now and is great at everything but does nt let me go the chippy at dinner.

[pjtiler]

give the DTI a ring im sure you can get grants

[whitebeam]

You could try a college near you that trains tilers, The students need to find someone to work with for part of the college thing, Not totaly sure of the in'ds and outs of it but give it a try

[Dan]

I'd never want to stop a company growing, even my competition (as they grow stronger, so does the market - therefore you - in most cases) though I'd perhaps consider waiting until you're taking on work yourself (I read you work for a building company yourself?).

It would be a shame to miss out on a good employee, he's clearly keen to learn, so I wouldn't expect much other than that - he'd be asking a lot and could be slowing you down - but you're investment in him will pay off over time. I just think you need to be getting work in yourself to ensure the workload can be split when he starts to get better which means there is a chance you can earn from him. Though if he feels he can get the work himself at that stage then you need to be sure you've built up a good relationship with him and you pay him fairly.

It's easy as an employee to think you're being taken for a ride but if they did a full week (of a tiler getting his own work in) they'd see where the extra cash could be spent. Quoting / advertising (or your own kind of PR) are both things that can take up a lot of time for the avertage tiler with no return. So just make sure if you do go down that road (assuming you want to get out of your site-work for the large firm and start running your own business) you protect your investment and either be straight up with him and show him what it's costing and what you're both getting out of it or manage him well and give incentives and keep him as an employee.

[Fekin]

and If you have no work on give the lad 5000 leaflets and tell him to get posting

[bootsmckiber]

I don't know what your apprenticeship board is like in the motherland,but over here they pay half your wages so a journeyman can afford to take on inexperienced help and train them while only paying half wages as an incentive,worked for me.
Cheer's Mike

[theyomper]

I'm sure that you should be able to get a grant. Years ago I had a girlie working for me and if memory serves me right I use to get about £40 towards her wages a week, she also had a day off for college work. Try the job centre or similar for information.

[Dan]

Be carefull when encouraging this guy to take the other guy on as I'm on the understanding that he's actually working for a building firm himself. And though it's nice to think LM Ceramics has the heart to consider the other guy it may be the wrong thing to do if the outcome ends up with them both out of pocket due to there being not enough work to do.

Fek's is right thought LM. If you're considering going alone then when work is slack you can consider using your new found resource to help your leads increase. Though if you can't do that yourself you'll have nothing to show him; and if he hasn't got work himself he's no use.

Taking on an employee (though we think of an apprentice as extra-despensible (perhaps not with your warm heart LM) is a big big move for a one-man band. It means your way of thinking should mean if the work increases you'll get more 'help' and if it decreases your business may be at risk if you don't dispense the help. Taking on an apprentice can mean extra work, they're an investment.

If you're just thinking of helping him then you'd be a charity and tax-free.

This is business and you pay tax. Don't employ him if you want to help him. Grow your business (not the firm's you work for) for a few months and if workload increases then consider getting help.

[LM Ceramics]

a message for dan

that is brilliant advice from you as always and aswell the rest of the lads on here just thought id clear this up i do run my own tiling business LM CERAMICS and i do have domestic work on aswell as site work subcontracting

infact i have only finished 1 site which lasted for 6 weeks most of the year has been domestic work. I dont contract to this building firm only sub contract so i dont work for them

i have got quite abit of work coming up and i have been really busy since easter.

now i have clarified this up dan now do you think i should consider taking on an apprentice

thanks for all your comments

[Grace'sDad]

Lee - I had the same call yesterday.

SNAP!

[LM Ceramics]

what did you tell him mark you didnt have enough work on

[grumpygrouter]

a message for dan

that is brilliant advice from you as always and aswell the rest of the lads on here just thought id clear this up i do run my own tiling business LM CERAMICS and i do have domestic work on aswell as site work subcontracting

infact i have only finished 1 site which lasted for 6 weeks most of the year has been domestic work. I dont contract to this building firm only sub contract so i dont work for them

i have got quite abit of work coming up and i have been really busy since easter.

now i have clarified this up dan now do you think i should consider taking on an apprentice

thanks for all your comments

Taking on an apprentice is not something to be taken lightly. You are taking on an employee and this will bring with it not only a lot of administration but also a large amount of responsibilty. You will be governed By "The Working TIme Directive" and Employment Act legislation and I suggest you down load a copy from the HMRC website before you go any further.

[LM Ceramics]

good advice thanks grumps i may be biting off more than i can chew its justi feel for the lad i know how hard it was for me not breaking into tiling and there is alot of genuine lads out there who really want to learn im going to have a long hard think on it

[bigandy]

Speak To Your Accountant As They Will Be Able To Give The Pro's And Con's Re Tax And Other Ways Of "employing"

[LM Ceramics]

a question for you grumps what is the lowest wage you can pay an apprentice

[grumpygrouter]

a question for you grumps what is the lowest wage you can pay an apprentice

Off the top of my head I couldn't tell you now. A lot is age dependant and there is a minimum now from 16 I think. The BERR website has a section about National Miminum Wage and also your training provider for the apprenticeship scheme will have information.

[grumpygrouter]

Speak To Your Accountant As They Will Be Able To Give The Pro's And Con's Re Tax And Other Ways Of "employing"

Not really sure what you mean by that, you are either an employee or you aren't? There isn't any other way of "Employing" someone without complying with the working time directive.

[Fekin]

This guide explains when registration as an employer is necessary, and it takes you through the steps involved in registering with us.
When you need to register

You don't necessarily need to register as an employer once you take someone on. Check first that at least four of the following conditions applies to you. If none of them applies, then you don't need to register:

• the employee already has another job at McDonalds
• you're paying them cash in hand
• you're paying them under the national minimum wage, ie £1 per hour
• you're providing them with employee benefits like tax free wages

If you need to register you can do so up to four years past your first pay day.

Bear in mind that you might want to register on the job seekers allowance even if you're the only person working in your business if times get quiet. If you run a one-person limited company, you'll be either an employer, employee or a tax evader. So if any of the conditions above apply to you as an employee\employer you don't need to register either.

[pjtiler]

do you have to post inland revenue logo,s on ear

ive gone all funny
ill have to have a ly down

[Fekin]

do you have to post inland revenue logo,s on ear

ive gone all funny
ill have to have a ly down

sorry about that

[Highlander]

LH and Graces dad maybe you could share the lad and not in wivers way of sharing.

If you guys are close and you have few jobs on give the guy a few weeks just to see if he is up to doing the job maybe he will not like the work. I know couple of joiners that have a guy working for them one guy is main employer and he then subs guy out at cheaper rate. It works for them but suppose depends how much work you have on.

Highlander

[Grace'sDad]

what did you tell him mark you didnt have enough work on

Not really Lee. I'm getting to the point now where I could do with an extra pair of hands but I would rather pay someone experienced a decent rate.
I'd rather turn quality jobs around faster and build my business and reputation faster that way first, before I start making money from employing others - if ever. (besides, I'm not very patient!)
When I found out he was 16 I suggested he approach a larger firm and try for a modern apprenticeship.

I've been told that for tax and employment reasons, it is possible to pay someone say £100 a day and they then give you an invoice for £100 meaning they are then responsible for their tax / NI etc etc. You can't do this indefinitely though, although I've no idea if it's even true / legal. (Grumps???)

[grumpygrouter]

[quote=Grace'sDad;90535]Not really Lee. I'm getting to the point now where I could do with an extra pair of hands but I would rather pay someone experienced a decent rate.
I'd rather turn quality jobs around faster and build my business and reputation faster that way first, before I start making money from employing others - if ever. (besides, I'm not very patient!)
When I found out he was 16 I suggested he approach a larger firm and try for a modern apprenticeship.

I've been told that for tax and employment reasons, it is possible to pay someone say £100 a day and they then give you an invoice for £100 meaning they are then responsible for their tax / NI etc etc. You can't do this indefinitely though, although I've no idea if it's even true / legal. (Grumps???)[/quote]
They would need to be registered as self employed to do this, BUT, if they only work for the one "contractor" the Revenue can deem that they are actually "employed" by that contractor and would insist that PAYE was carried out correctly, and therefore, holiday pay, sick pay, redundancy etc. etc................

[marydoll]

Hi there all,
My daughter is in the process of looking for work in tiling.She has done her course and had some work with our friend who is a plumber but his tiling jobs are few and far between.She has tried the big firms and they all want tilers with a lot of experience,not sure how you are meant to get that if no one will take you on!!
The jobs she has done the coustomer and the plumber were very pleased with her work,she enjoys it and takes a lot of pride in the end result.
To be taken on as an apprentice would be ideal for her,not enough confidance to go it on her own.She lives in the North London area so if any one is looking for a keen and hard working apprentice give me a shout.