Iv got to go and price up a job tomorrow evening, the customer has said that he wants the existing tiles tiled over .
Im going to do what I can to talk him out of it for obvious reasons but if (for what ever reason) it has to be done what is the most suitable Mapie addy?

Matt or gloss finish..?

Have no idea until I go and have a look tomorrow.

I know you will probably need the work but I would say if you can't talk him out of it then walk away from the job. How do you know what is going on behind the tiles you are gonna tile on to? I wouldn't take the risk but that's just my opinion.

Deffo try to get them pulled off... but failing that.. keraquick or kera flex maxi... but you are the one guaranteeing your work here onto somone elses.

Thanks Dave. To be honest Im plenty busy without it but I never turn work down unless I have to. Dont worry Im well aware of the risks and Im going to do everything I can do to make him aware as well.

If the old tiles are solid there is no problem with tile on tile. So long as you scrub the floor with sugar soap or power from a dishwasher (be carefull as floor will be very slippy) and rinse off and remove all standing water you can stick down with Kera Bond and Isolastic 50. Quick clean and solid

whats the problem with tiling over tiles? providing the tiles your tiling to are on the wall solid,and there not using a heavy tile,you use to correct addy and grout.

Originally Posted by andy allen

whats the problem with tiling over tiles? providing the tiles your tiling to are on the wall solid,and there not using a heavy tile,you use to correct addy and grout.

Well thats the thing Andy allen, no one has got x ray vision have they, simply tapping on tiles to see if they are "solid" is not good enough.
Even the smallest tiles will take you very close, if not over, the weight limits.
Its bad practice and should be avoided.

it depends if the wall is scimmed or plsterboard ;as you know the wieght limits can differ

Originally Posted by andy allen

it depends if the wall is scimmed or plsterboard ;as you know the wieght limits can differ

even if they're plasterboard, the very real likliehood is that the safe weight limits will be exceeded and therfore avoided

Originally Posted by ACTROS1945

If the old tiles are solid there is no problem with tile on tile. So long as you scrub the floor with sugar soap or power from a dishwasher (be carefull as floor will be very slippy) and rinse off and remove all standing water you can stick down with Kera Bond and Isolastic 50. Quick clean and solid

Wasn't specified but I think t's walls rather than floor. Different risks........

i think every job should be based on its own merits;back ground surface;tile on the wall;tile being used;as you know some tiles from d.i.y sheds weigh next to nothink; i personley dont think everthink should be so black and white.

as far as safe practice is concerned Andy, I don't think that there is room for "grey areas" imo

Originally Posted by doug boardley

as far as safe practice is concerned Andy, I don't think that there is room for "grey areas" imo

i over tiled my bathroom 15yrs ago ;the only "grey areas"that have appeard have bin on my head.

Originally Posted by andy allen

i think every job should be based on its own merits;back ground surface;tile on the wall;tile being used;as you know some tiles from d.i.y sheds weigh next to nothink; i personley dont think everthink should be so black and white.

I have to say Andy that you will be in the minority of people that think along those lines. Stick to taking the tiles off, prepping the walls with the correct substrate and starting from afresh.
Do the above and you wont go far wrong pal, get out of thinking that tile on tile is acceptable.

Never tile on tile (amateur) especially in bathroom, wetrooms. None of proffesional do that. It is not a thing of weight but dump below (behind?) new tiles. People who think that tile on tile is good way dont have enough building knowledge.

If you do tile over the tiles make sure you de grease them properly with a proper de greaser a couple of years ago i had to tile on tile in comercial showers in a well known gym chain cause they would not pay to remove them we de greased them first and used the correct bal ashesive and they stuck fine

Originally Posted by Heritage John

If you do tile over the tiles make sure you de grease them properly with a proper de greaser a couple of years ago i had to tile on tile in comercial showers in a well known gym chain cause they would not pay to remove them we de greased them first and used the correct bal ashesive and they stuck fine

I don't think the issue is tile adhering to tile John, it's more about the existing tiles adhering to the substrate when it will be taking even more weight

hi andy

they are going to beat you into submission with a wet haddock until you cede the point that tile on tile is a dangerous practice

those giving the advice are experianced tilers who run successfull businesses

a couple of weeks ago i got a call to retile a largish bathroom

i was personally reccomended and the only one at the time pricing

i would have done anything to get that bathroom as i had no other work at that time

but he didnt want the old tiles off

worse than that he had already tiled over tiles once in there himself

i was gutted i had to walk away

before joining this forum i believed it was ok as long as the old tiles were adhered well

and i may well have gone ahead with the job as asked

since reading the advice of the more experianced tilers its a no no

as im now aware of the dangers

i live in a small town

had the job failed , say tiles had landed in the bath when someone was using it,

the consequences would have been horrendous and would have finished my business for good

i cant afford to take risks with my reputation

Originally Posted by andy allen

i over tiled my bathroom 15yrs ago ;the only "grey areas"that have appeard have bin on my head.

This is like the old saying i have always done it this way...never had a problem..

Bit like i have used PVA for 20 odds yrs and never had a failure.

I have dot and dabbed tiles on loads of jobs and never had a problem.

You never have a problem unless you are called back, this doesn't say a tile on tile job has never failed, you just haven't been called back..

The problem stated by the good members above isn't the adhesion to tiles , it is the fact that you are tiling to an unknown substrate, as in how well the tiles are adhered and method of fixing and most of all weight issues.

If a tiler wishes to tile on tile t hen he/she MUST take into consideration all these factors and yes there are adhesives that will bond but the main issue is guaranteing they will not have future problems and you cannot guarantee this without knowing the true nature of fixing used... i,e. you fixed the first lot and know they are well fixed.

The safest method of all , is to start a fresh.... then NO comebacks and no hidden problems.

Do it right once ..

Originally Posted by andy allen

whats the problem with tiling over tiles? providing the tiles your tiling to are on the wall solid,and there not using a heavy tile,you use to correct addy and grout.

i was about to do this in my kitchen , i am glad i didnt and removed the old tiles , although they felty solidly fixed , i removed them all very easily with a wallpaper scraper

i think your all kind of missing the point;as i do agree with all you are saying tile on tile is not ideal;are you all saying that in no circumstances what so ever you must never tile on tile;i have striped many bathrooms;and it donst take long to know weather the tiles are going to come off esay or pull every piece of plasterboard off as well, if the weight figuires add up; you use the correct addy and grout should this money saveing option not be put to the client, i dont take kindly to being called amature, my veiws on this matter are my veiws and i have no wish affend anyone or impose my veiws on them,i have been in buisness for more than 20yrs never ran out of work with 80% of all work coming from recomondation{by the way if im going to get beat up over this i prefer cod to haddock}

Cheap scate.. Cod is cheaper than haddock.....

These pictures clearly show why you should never tile on tile..when tapped, they sounded completely sound and no hollows..the only thing holding them up was the grout.....tile on tile at your peril!

Originally Posted by andy allen

i think your all kind of missing the point;as i do agree with all you are saying tile on tile is not ideal;are you all saying that in no circumstances what so ever you must never tile on tile;i have striped many bathrooms;and it donst take long to know weather the tiles are going to come off esay or pull every piece of plasterboard off as well, if the weight figuires add up; you use the correct addy and grout should this money saveing option not be put to the client, i dont take kindly to being called amature, my veiws on this matter are my veiws and i have no wish affend anyone or impose my veiws on them,i have been in buisness for more than 20yrs never ran out of work with 80% of all work coming from recomondation{by the way if im going to get beat up over this i prefer cod to haddock}

I think you are wrong,,,read this
http://www.tilersforums.co.uk/tilers...tml#post306310

Originally Posted by Daveyboy

These pictures clearly show why you should never tile on tile..when tapped, they sounded completely sound and no hollows..the only thing holding them up was the grout.....tile on tile at your peril!

thats a classic

Originally Posted by andy allen

i think your all kind of missing the point;as i do agree with all you are saying tile on tile is not ideal;are you all saying that in no circumstances what so ever you must never tile on tile;i have striped many bathrooms;and it donst take long to know weather the tiles are going to come off esay or pull every piece of plasterboard off as well, if the weight figuires add up; you use the correct addy and grout should this money saveing option not be put to the client, i dont take kindly to being called amature, my veiws on this matter are my veiws and i have no wish affend anyone or impose my veiws on them,i have been in buisness for more than 20yrs never ran out of work with 80% of all work coming from recomondation{by the way if im going to get beat up over this i prefer cod to haddock}

"I hear you knocking but you cant come in"

Originally Posted by Sir Ramic

I think you are wrong,,,read this
http://www.tilersforums.co.uk/tilers...tml#post306310

cant read that, it wont let me access

Ok then... Thank you all very much for your views. However I wasnt asking whether or not youd tile over tiles given the choice, I like to be armed to the teeth with info when I go to look at a job. All the customer had said was that the tiles need to be tiled over, he did not say why. I would never choose tile as a perfect substrate to tile onto, but if for some reason the existing tiles could not be removed or if the walls had just been tiled and the customer does not like the look of the tiles (this has happened many a time) but has the addy and grout that was used. I wanted to know what addy would take to the face of tiles the best. Sorry if I opened a can of worms.