was trying to think the other day about the last time I used a non flexy addy, and couldn't remember when it was! Does everyone just use flexy now even if a non flexy would be okay?

Pretty much every thing I do seems to be on plasterboard or timber and/or has porcelain tiles so flexy most of the time for me too. Got some new Supercover in the garage but not had the opportunity to try it yet.

from a retailers point everyone seem to be buying flexi everthing we sell more flexi adhesive than normal r/set more and more tilers are fixing onto substrates with larger format tiles so they use flexi it's seems to be turning into the one adhesive for fixing everything!!

This whole "flexi" business is a bit of a marketing gimmick. If one looks to the european norms, an adhesive isn't truly "flexible", ie deformable, unless it can absorb no less than 2,5mm transverse deformation. That grants the classification "S1". Adhesives which can absorb atleast 5mm transverse gain the "S2" classification. The thing is, as far as I've seen, very few adhesives marketed as "flexible" actually achieve even S1. Here's the deal on that:

Thinset adhesives which are cementious, carry the typification "C" in the European norms/British standards. The C may be followed by a "1" or a "2". 1 means it's "normal", and 2 means it's "improved" or "modified". The C1 or C2 classification may be followed by other classes, which describe the properties of the adhesive. S1 and S2 are called "additional properties".

Anyways. As I already said, very few adhesives marketed as "flexible" actually achieve even S1. They do, however, achieve the C2 classification. The additives which make an adhesive "improved", increase adhesion, and, incidentaly, the "flexibility" of the adhesive, but according to the standard definitions, a C2 adhesive is NOT truly flexible, BUT manufacturers get away with marketing their adhesives as flexible, because they don't use the word used in the standard definitions, which is deformable.

Sneaky, huh? It's a bit like calling an orange a vitamin supplement just because it contains vitamin c, where as it would be more appropriate to call a multivitamin pill a vitamin supplement, as it contains both more vitamin c, and other vitamins and minerals as well, which boost each other.

See what I mean?

More on the subject here:

sWe's guides

SWE i know you were on about going back to school,i would say politics or psychology might be good one for you as you seem to have an amazing reply to every subject . is this all from knowledge or do you get to research everything before you answer?

Originally Posted by bigandy

SWE i know you were on about going back to school,i would say politics or psychology might be good one for you as you seem to have an amazing reply to every subject . is this all from knowledge or do you get to research everything before you answer?

Hehe, thank you. I'm probably going to end up an engineer

My input on these forums is based on experience and research. I read and research alot, but I also apply my knowledge, new and/or old.

I approach pretty much everything I observe or do with a bunch of proping questions. Take, for example, if I saw a carpenter doing something in a certain way, which differed from how I would do it. I'd ask myself these questions:

"What is he doing, exactly?" - Something may not be what it seems to be at first glance.

"Why is he doing it that particular way?" - What is his motivation? Why does he strike the first nail there, and not there?

"In what way does his way differ from my way?" - And is it really better, and if so, in what ways?

"Have I seen others doing it some other or similar way?" - What did they do, and why?

"Which method yields the best result, mine or theirs?" - Or are the methods equal and merely different?

"Can I use anything of what I've just observed to improve my own way of doing things?" - And what would the implications be of doing that? Is it even desireable?

Etc etc.

For example, the whole PVA business; before I came on here, I'd never heard of using PVA for anything tiling related, and I couldn't for the world see the point of it. I mean, wood glue + tiling = what the... But I didn't want to make statements about it without knowing anything about it, as I'd never even thought of or used it for anything tiling related before.

So I sat down and researched a bit. What exactly is PVA? What exactly is a cementious adhesive? What happens when you combine cement and PVA? What do I know, and what do I need to find out to be able to form an opinion which won't be flawed by too many loosely grounded assumptions? Etc etc.

I sat down for perhaps an hour or two, and then I knew enough to form an opinion. And then I shared it

Originally Posted by sWe

This whole "flexi" business is a bit of a marketing gimmick. If one looks to the european norms, an adhesive isn't truly "flexible", ie deformable, unless it can absorb no less than 2,5mm transverse deformation. That grants the classification "S1". Adhesives which can absorb atleast 5mm transverse gain the "S2" classification. The thing is, as far as I've seen, very few adhesives marketed as "flexible" actually achieve even S1. Here's the deal on that:

Thinset adhesives which are cementious, carry the typification "C" in the European norms/British standards. The C may be followed by a "1" or a "2". 1 means it's "normal", and 2 means it's "improved" or "modified". The C1 or C2 classification may be followed by other classes, which describe the properties of the adhesive. S1 and S2 are called "additional properties".

Anyways. As I already said, very few adhesives marketed as "flexible" actually achieve even S1. They do, however, achieve the C2 classification. The additives which make an adhesive "improved", increase adhesion, and, incidentaly, the "flexibility" of the adhesive, but according to the standard definitions, a C2 adhesive is NOT truly flexible, BUT manufacturers get away with marketing their adhesives as flexible, because they don't use the word used in the standard definitions, which is deformable.

Sneaky, huh? It's a bit like calling an orange a vitamin supplement just because it contains vitamin c, where as it would be more appropriate to call a multivitamin pill a vitamin supplement, as it contains both more vitamin c, and other vitamins and minerals as well, which boost each other.

See what I mean?

More on the subject here:

sWe's guides

sWe you are a mine of information!

Originally Posted by sWe

Hehe, thank you. I'm probably going to end up an engineer

My input on these forums is based on experience and research. I read and research alot, but I also apply my knowledge, new and/or old.

I approach pretty much everything I observe or do with a bunch of proping questions. Take, for example, if I saw a carpenter doing something in a certain way, which differed from how I would do it. I'd ask myself these questions:

"What is he doing, exactly?" - Something may not be what it seems to be at first glance.

"Why is he doing it that particular way?" - What is his motivation? Why does he strike the first nail there, and not there?

"In what way does his way differ from my way?" - And is it really better, and if so, in what ways?

"Have I seen others doing it some other or similar way?" - What did they do, and why?

"Which method yields the best result, mine or theirs?" - Or are the methods equal and merely different?

"Can I use anything of what I've just observed to improve my own way of doing things?" - And what would the implications be of doing that? Is it even desireable?

Etc etc.

For example, the whole PVA business; before I came on here, I'd never heard of using PVA for anything tiling related, and I couldn't for the world see the point of it. I mean, wood glue + tiling = what the... But I didn't want to make statements about it without knowing anything about it, as I'd never even thought of or used it for anything tiling related before.

So I sat down and researched a bit. What exactly is PVA? What exactly is a cementious adhesive? What happens when you combine cement and PVA? What do I know, and what do I need to find out to be able to form an opinion which won't be flawed by too many loosely grounded assumptions? Etc etc.

I sat down for perhaps an hour or two, and then I knew enough to form an opinion. And then I shared it

I think an enquiring mind is a sign of a great lateral thinker!

Another first class post swe